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10-31-2009, 09:20 PM
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Cross-examine it!
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Orcutt, CA.
Posts: 6,736
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Re: Lot's Revelation of Grace
Quote:
Originally Posted by Edward Anglin
No assumption at all.
Read the Bible narrative.
Daniel's choices are completely opposite of Lots.
And, again, one was surrounded by filth by choice, the other by compulsion.
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What of those who live in cities like LA, NY, San Fran. heck even DC. I work in Dupont Circle, my office is literally right across the street from a strip club, there are more gay bars in that area than you can count, it is the heart of filth in terms of sin but I have no desire to participate. Yet I choose to have an office there.
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"Beware lest you lose the substance by grasping at the shadow." ~Aesop
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10-31-2009, 09:21 PM
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Cross-examine it!
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Join Date: Mar 2008
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Re: Lot's Revelation of Grace
Quote:
Originally Posted by mizpeh
I'm not assuming I know every time I sin. But if I know I have sinned, then I must repent or I am not righteous. And God is gracious. He gives space to repent.
I reject the idea that you can knowingly sin and continue in sin and be declared righteous before God.
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I don't find any indication that when someone sins they are declared unrighteous. I completely reject that teaching.
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"Beware lest you lose the substance by grasping at the shadow." ~Aesop
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10-31-2009, 09:24 PM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 5,529
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Re: Lot's Revelation of Grace
Quote:
Originally Posted by Edward Anglin
I admit it was akin to rape. But I still believe his actions contributed.
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Sure, taking them to an isolated cave caused them to fear to the point they assumed there was no one else alive, thus the conspiracy to get dad drunk and procreate. Apparently Lot would not have consented, thus their plan.
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Psa 119:165 (KJV) 165 Great peace have they which love thy law: and nothing shall offend them.
"Do not believe everthing you read on the internet" - Abe Lincoln
Last edited by RevDWW; 10-31-2009 at 09:29 PM.
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10-31-2009, 09:24 PM
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Cross-examine it!
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Orcutt, CA.
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Re: Lot's Revelation of Grace
Quote:
Originally Posted by Edward Anglin
If you would replace the word positive with the word righteous I think we could reach a concensus.
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Well I guess I don't see actions as being the determinative factor in one being declared righteous. Well, not mans actions anyway. I am only declared righteous because of the cross. I think Lot was righteous because God said he was, that's not to say every action was righteous.
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"Beware lest you lose the substance by grasping at the shadow." ~Aesop
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10-31-2009, 09:26 PM
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>>Primitive Pentecostal<<
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,892
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Re: Lot's Revelation of Grace
Goodnight, folks.
Becoming way too circular for me.
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The world has lost the power to blush over its vice; the Church has lost her power to weep over it.
Leonard Ravenhill
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10-31-2009, 09:27 PM
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Cross-examine it!
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Join Date: Mar 2008
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Re: Lot's Revelation of Grace
Quote:
Originally Posted by Edward Anglin
Goodnight, folks.
Becoming way too circular for me.
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C'mon Ed, your not that old yet. Have a cup of coffee and stick around a bit. Other than where you are wrong we are not that far apart. 
__________________
"Beware lest you lose the substance by grasping at the shadow." ~Aesop
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10-31-2009, 09:28 PM
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 10,749
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Re: Lot's Revelation of Grace
Quote:
Originally Posted by Edward Anglin
Is that what the Bible says?
How old was Seth when he married? Whom did he marry?
Do you have proof?
Miz, you are filling in blanks, and that's dangerous.
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The line of descendants had to come from either Cain, Abel, Seth or another male offspring of Adam and Eve. Seth would have to have married someone he was related to. Either one of Cain's descendants. Or one of Abel's descendants (if Abel had children). Or one of his other possible brother's descendants.
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His banner over me is LOVE....  My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?
To be a servant of God, it will cost us our total commitment to God, and God alone. His burden must be our burden... Sis Alvear
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10-31-2009, 09:33 PM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 10,749
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Re: Lot's Revelation of Grace
Quote:
Originally Posted by Edward Anglin
If you would replace the word positive with the word righteous I think we could reach a concensus.
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On what grounds did God declare him righteous?
We are declared righteous because of the blood of Christ.
__________________
His banner over me is LOVE.... My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?
To be a servant of God, it will cost us our total commitment to God, and God alone. His burden must be our burden... Sis Alvear
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10-31-2009, 09:38 PM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 10,749
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Re: Lot's Revelation of Grace
Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron1710
I don't find any indication that when someone sins they are declared unrighteous. I completely reject that teaching.
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19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God
If you don't inherit the kingdom of God because of sin, then it stands to reason that you will not be declared righteous before the throne of Christ.
__________________
His banner over me is LOVE.... My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?
To be a servant of God, it will cost us our total commitment to God, and God alone. His burden must be our burden... Sis Alvear
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10-31-2009, 09:45 PM
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Cross-examine it!
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Orcutt, CA.
Posts: 6,736
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Re: Lot's Revelation of Grace
Quote:
Originally Posted by mizpeh
19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God
If you don't inherit the kingdom of God because of sin, then it stands to reason that you will not be declared righteous before the throne of Christ.
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The verse you posted is not a list of sins that keep people from heaven it is a list of lifestyles.
Practise (prassontes). Prassō is the verb for habitual practice (our very word, in fact), not poieō for occasional doing. The habit of these sins is proof that one is not in the Kingdom of God and will not inherit it.
Word Pictures in the NT by A.T. Robertson
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"Beware lest you lose the substance by grasping at the shadow." ~Aesop
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