How To Go To Hell: An Observation of Cons and Libs

[CC1]

Originally Posted by Carpenter

Woa, I think this could be the absolute best post you have ever written given the context of this topic.

I think some though, will dismiss it outright because it contains too much common sense, which we know is sin of the flesh.

Unfortunetely it was a long one and I know that most long ones don't get read. I just didn't know any way to say it shorter in the time I had to post.

Originally Posted by Beard

How can one tell if he is walking in the light as Jesus is in the light, having fellowship with one another (blood flow in the body of Christ by love for the brethren-charity), and the blood of Jesus cleansing from all unrighteousness?

Con or lib? which box goes to hell?

To be presented blameless both spirit, soul, and body is not a white washing act, neither is it one prayer or baptism alone, but a process in receiving the engrafted Word of God which alone is able to save us, being not a hearer of the Word, but a doer of the Word as well as speaking the oracles of God; for by our words we shall be justified, and by our words we shall be condemned; for out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks. Key word="Engrafted Word of God" is Word that is Holy Life inborn into us as the only seed of Jesus that gives life in our human natural bodies into which it is planted; being engrafted inwardly in the spirit and heart, not in the flesh from without; thus fulfilling the law of the Spirit of life within, not the letter of the law from without. The incorruptible seed of the Word of God cannot be corrupted and therefore will accomplish its purpose in the believer that believes it, acts on it and speaks according to it. The believer that attempts to please God in the flesh will be disappointed, for there is nothing in the flesh accepted of God, for in the flesh dwells no good thing. Therefore what is the heart behind the action?

Bottom line requirements: we must have our eyes of understanding and ears to hear the Word as it received in the heart and moved on in action, doing the will of God as to the present flowing truth of the Word, in addition the tongue must speak the things of God as oracles by the unction of the Spirit, for no man can tame the tongue as it is an unruly member, set on fire of hell. Can a man do these things? Yes, only by the Spirit of God as one works out their own salvation.

The tongue is the ultimate fruit of the Spirit, not only doing the things of God, but speaking those things as well, with the things of the Spirit as to the will and purpose of God being worked out in the individual believer for which he or she was created; the Spirit flows through the believer's spirit, received in the soul by one's daily sacrifice, then manifested in the mortal body showing the marks of the cross, the tongue being bridled or led by the Spirit of God; thus the whole man; spirit, soul, and body presented blameless and raised at the last day which is the will of God for all.

In conclusion, any judgment set on man as to outward appearance rather than the heart by the Spirit of God is futile and leads to destruction, regardless of con or lib.

Heaven or hell is not speaking a one time prayer, or just being baptized only, but a life led of the Spirit of God in all things. For the dress code and outward adorning must not be of the outward appearance as pertains to the flesh, but a reflection of the heart revealing the spiritual man rather than the natural. IMO

Good stuff.

Originally Posted by Steadfast

Good stuff.

Amen.

Bro. Beard always says and writes good stuff. Subscribe to his newsletter and you will be blessed with a lot of goodstuff.

Originally Posted by Brother Strange

Amen.

Bro. Beard always says and writes good stuff. Subscribe to his newsletter and you will be blessed with a lot of goodstuff.

Newsletter?

[The Dean]

He has a web site listed as well.

[John Atkinson]

Originally Posted by Steadfast

Well, been a while since I started a thread so I thought I'd offer the forum something to think about... and something to hear your opinions of.

For a couple weeks now I've been deeply troubled about some things I see encroaching into the Apostolic movement around us leaving great damage in it's wake.

First of all, I'll offer a couple disclaimers:
1. To begin with I'm coming from the perspective of a Conservative (a fact that some will no doubt cast doubt on) and realize that some will think my view is too skewed to be accurate.
2. Secondly, I'm in NO WAY saying this is an 'across the board 100% included' observation for either conservatives of liberals.

Here is where my heart has been troubled during the past few weeks. I love all the brethren - ministry and laity / conservative and liberals / passionate and passive - and want them all to make the necessary life adjustments to ultimately be saved. However, I know that some will be lost. The Bible makes that plain.

After a few recent weeks of spending a lot of time by myself in Evangelist Quarters with plenty of time to pray I find myself grieving for both extremes among us. Let me explain. After several intense seasons of prayer last week my heart came to a sad conclusion:

Liberals are going to be lost and go to Hell for laying down Biblical absolutes and
Conservatives are going to be lost and go to Hell because of a 'spirit' of entitlement.

That may not sound like much (except a challenge to both sides) until you hear me out. I do believe that it takes sanctification and separation from the world to be saved. Some liberals will fail miserably in that area. But I also believe that it takes a pure heart and a life void of what the Bible calls 'guile' to be saved. Some conservatives will fail equally as miserably in that area.

A lack of holiness allows some liberal Saints to wander into blatant iniquity and still feel saved.
A spirit of 'entitlement' allows some conservative Saint to have vicious attitudes
under the guise of "I'm still holy so I'm entitled to feel this way."

A lack of holiness allows some liberal Preachers to fail God miserably by easing from 'liberty' to 'license' for sinful actions.
A spirit of 'entitlement' allows some conservative Preachers to become vile towards authority
in their own lives and feel entitled to it because "I never let go of any standards like some."

A lack of holiness allows some liberal Pastors to have affairs because it's a short distance from
laying down the 'be careful little eyes' stuff to laying down someone that doesn't belong to you.
A spirit of 'entitlement' allows some conservative Pastors to have affairs because
"I give so much of myself to others that I'm entitled to getting a little attention myself."

My dear friends on AFF... It's blatant deception to think that laying down biblical absolutes will never destroy the soul. It's even more deceptive to think that just because we preach a strong message that we're entitled to have certain sins, attitudes or 'shortcomings' exempted from God's displeasure.

How can those who know so much go to Hell?
Many liberals will miss Heaven over their compromise.
Many conservatives will miss Heaven because a 'spirit of entitlement' opened the door to sin in their hearts.

PREACH, MY BRETHREN, AGAINST SIN WITH A HOLY PASSION
BUT NEVER - EVER - BELIEVE THAT ENTITLES YOU TO BE LESS THAN HOLY!

Amen is about all I can say here. Good thoughts to think about and chew on

Originally Posted by John Atkinson

Amen is about all I can say here. Good thoughts to think about and chew on

Thank you. Now the real question is are you an entitled con, a compromised lib or one of those messed up middle ground people?




JUST KIDDING!





Thanks again!

DISCLAIMER: I know that there are those who are neither of the three. (Just trying to halt all the assailing bullets being chambered in the guns for an ugly purpose!)

Originally Posted by Steadfast

Thank you. Now the real question is are you an entitled con, a compromised lib or one of those messed up middle ground people?




JUST KIDDING!





Thanks again!

DISCLAIMER: I know that there are those who are neither of the three. (Just trying to halt all the assailing bullets being chambered in the guns for an ugly purpose!)

The problem of being a moderate conservative is the same problem with a armadillo in the middle of the road...you get run over from both directions. LOL

[originalsecretplace]

Originally Posted by Steadfast

* Another Pastor that I know had me preach for him. Hearing that he may know another man who had asked me to come preach I decided to ask him about the man - whom I knew nothing about. We were walking off the platform to the office... where, after my preaching, he marched into the pulpit and hit his congregation with the whole clothesline of standards (and had a right as the Pastor to do so!)... when I asked him, "Hey, Brother, someone said you might know Bro. ***" he stopped, turned and looked at me and said, "Know him? I hate his guts! It wouldn't hurt me if he died and went to Hell!" It seemed that the Brother about whom I inquired had broken fellowship with this crew because, with a Church full of new converts, he didn't want them assaulted every service with standards. Thus, the 'holier' one was 'entitled' to literally hate the Pastor protecting his new converts! (Yes, I know the entire story and that is exactly what happened.)

Precious friends, in my opinion BOTH stories are critically sad but the second story is WORSE than the first to me! At least the first made his mistakes claiming to have found 'liberty from legalism' while the second man made his mistakes while seemingly believing that his 'holiness' gave him a special pass to hate his own brother!

In truth? I just believe that a 'spirit of entitlement' is just as bad or worse than a 'spirit of compromise'.

Originally Posted by beard

In conclusion, any judgment set on man as to outward appearance rather than the heart by the Spirit of God is futile and leads to destruction, regardless of con or lib.

I have to post on the position of the laity in this instance since I am not in the ministry. I'm not sure the ministry fully understand the position we, as laity, find ourselves in when dealing with judgements of others with outward appearance.

The placement of these measuring devices leads to our judgement and separation of ourselves from our Bros and Sisters in the Lord. The measurement is fundamentally devisive. It does not divide light from dark as the Gospel does but brother against brother (light vs light).

If you preach that the way to express holiness is in "such and such" absolute which is based on appearence then the laity will judge others by that measurement. One of the major principles in scripture (one of which all the law and prophets hang) is love your brother. If you don't have love you don't have God. If you can't love you brother who you see, how can you say you love God who you can't see? If you separate yourself from your brother how can you still say you love him? I think it's hypocritical to say one thing and do the opposite.

Under no circumstances can I find in scripture where I am to separate myself from my brother except for sin and then only until the brother repents. Time and time again in scriptures, in the Gospels and the epistles, we see where we must forgive and must not judge or cause someone to stumble. Yet the great divide goes up between us based on outward differences.

[Newman]

Originally Posted by originalsecretplace

I have to post on the position of the laity in this instance since I am not in the ministry. I'm not sure the ministry fully understand the position we, as laity, find ourselves in when dealing with judgements of others with outward appearance.

The placement of these measuring devices leads to our judgement and separation of ourselves from our Bros and Sisters in the Lord. The measurement is fundamentally devisive. It does not divide light from dark as the Gospel does but brother against brother (light vs light).

If you preach that the way to express holiness is in "such and such" absolute which is based on appearence then the laity will judge others by that measurement. One of the major principles in scripture (one of which all the law and prophets hang) is love your brother. If you don't have love you don't have God. If you can't love you brother who you see, how can you say you love God who you can't see? If you separate yourself from your brother how can you still say you love him? I think it's hypocritical to say one thing and do the opposite.

Under no circumstances can I find in scripture where I am to separate myself from my brother except for sin and then only until the brother repents. Time and time again in scriptures, in the Gospels and the epistles, we see where we must forgive and must not judge or cause someone to stumble. Yet the great divide goes up between us based on outward differences.

Great post.