Wow, some people seem to be intentionally missing the analogy. I know they are not that dense. Let me see if I can break it down for you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by philjones
Sis. Roxanne's mother in law brought the harmful things from outside the home into the home to keep the boys from going outside the home to do them.
Sis. Roxanne feels that we are bringing in harmful (worldly) things from outside the church into the church to keep our kids from going outside the church to do them.
One doesn't make any more sense than the other.
I am not taking a position here... simply clarifying for the intentionally obtuse!
With all respect, your post appears to me to be intentionally obtuse and unnecessarily belligerent.
We do have a problem with our young people "going out to party..." but to the best of my knowledge, we have never had a problem with young people going out into the streets waving sticks and branches around in praise to the Lord Jesus Christ.
SISTER Murphy made a 1 to 1 comparison between giving children drugs and alcohol and that dowel rod thing that some are trying. I find that type of association to be deliberately misleading, however I asked politely for clarification before stating such.
Clear the cobwebs out of your own head Phil. Drink some coffee or maybe even wave a stick around in the air to get your circulation going.
For what it's worth: I have observed two posters - SISTER Murphy and Phil Jones make some very damning and hurtful charges on this thread. It's still early, but I wonder if we will see the usual game played out here-
The "conservatives" falsely charge their brethren with an innuendo and then those brethren respond asking for clarification and challenging the "conservatives" to actually take a stand on principle.
Then the "conservatives" drop out of the thread altogether and refuse to take ownership for their own words against their brethren, only to pop up on some other thread and do the same thing all over again. They did this on FCF, they do this on other apostolic boards... I'm waiting to see what happens here.
For the record: Sister Murphy made a 1 to 1 comparison between Lady Rev's ministry and the criminal act of giving drugs and alcohol to children.
When I compared lady Rev's kids waving sticks to the disciples waving palm branches Phil Jones called me "intentionally obtuse."
My challenge: Is the ministry of Lady Rev comparable to the criminal enticement of children; or is Lady Rev's ministry more along the lines of the disciples of Jesus Christ as described in the Gospel of Luke? Perhaps you have an alternative view?
Lady Rev has answered for herself. Phil, SISTER Murphy?
For what it's worth: I have observed two posters - SISTER Murphy and Phil Jones make some very damning and hurtful charges on this thread. It's still early, but I wonder if we will see the usual game played out here-
The "conservatives" falsely charge their brethren with an innuendo and then those brethren respond asking for clarification and challenging the "conservatives" to actually take a stand on principle.
Then the "conservatives" drop out of the thread altogether and refuse to take ownership for their own words against their brethren, only to pop up on some other thread and do the same thing all over again. They did this on FCF, they do this on other apostolic boards... I'm waiting to see what happens here.
For the record: Sister Murphy made a 1 to 1 comparison between Lady Rev's ministry and the criminal act of giving drugs and alcohol to children.
When I compared lady Rev's kids waving sticks to the disciples waving palm branches Phil Jones called me "intentionally obtuse."
My challenge: Is the ministry of Lady Rev comparable to the criminal enticement of children; or is Lady Rev's ministry more along the lines of the disciples of Jesus Christ as described in the Gospel of Luke? Perhaps you have an alternative view?
Lady Rev has answered for herself. Phil, SISTER Murphy?
Excuse me, I do work for a living and I travel.
You can rest assured that your brand of challenge is no more intimidating than it is inviting.
What Sis. Roxanne was doing was drawing a parallel between bringing things from the world into the church in order to keep our kids. If you honestly could not see her analogy was nothing like you portrayed it then I owe you an apology. You were not "intentionally" obtuse... just obtuse.
Just as an FYI... as I already stated... I was not taking a position on the issue... just the way Roxanne's post was being misconstrued. I personally enjoy the stick dramas and the dramatic interpretive signing like that done by Sis. Loida Howell. I am in favor of a certain measure of currency in dealing with our youth. I am not, however, in favor of trying to become so much like the world that our youth functions are indistinguishable from the local raves.
When you grow up, come on back and play and maybe we can have a decent conversation based on what is real and not what you perceive to be real!
I congratulate you, you work pretty fast for a living - there's less than 10 minutes between our posts.
I have no intention of trying to intimidate you. I don't know you but consider us brethren through a shared gospel experience. That being said, I find it pretty hard to see how I have misconstrued the 1 to 1 comparison in question.
I hope you unlearn your new habit of name calling. Other posts by you have actually been helpful and informative. From your over all tone I see that you are probably locked into an unhelpful frame of mind and unable to see even your own actions and words in a clear light- let alone with a clear head.
I congratulate you, you work pretty fast for a living - there's less than 10 minutes between our posts.
I have no intention of trying to intimidate you. I don't know you but consider us brethren through a shared gospel experience. That being said, I find it pretty hard to see how I have misconstrued the 1 to 1 comparison in question.
I hope you unlearn your new habit of name calling. Other posts by you have actually been helpful and informative. From your over all tone I see that you are probably locked into an unhelpful frame of mind and unable to see even your own actions and words in a clear light- let alone with a clear head.
Obviously, we are not communicating and I really didn't intend to call names or offend. I just find it hard to believe that you don't see that there was no specific correlation between the drugs and the other activities. It was an analogy comparing the behavior of the responsible party in each case bringing in something traditionally viewed as harmful into a protected environment in an effort to keep the ones they were responsible for from going outside to do them.
Roxanne and many traditional Apostolic Pentecostals view these efforts to blend the church and the world in the light I have described above.
Again, I apologized if my reference to your being obtuse was offensive. That was not my intent. I just honestly felt like Sis. Murphy was being unfairly judged and I could not believe that the comparisons made were being made legitimately. My bad!
I am glad that in the past I have been helpful. I certainly wouldn't want a misunderstanding to prevent my being able to help in the future. I think if you watch my posting you will see that I am fairly direct but also fairly fair. I think we all should be more tolerant of one another and I will defend both sides of the aisle in principle... even if I don't personally agree with them in practice.
Yours are the words of a gentleman. I too, felt that I was defending the honor and ministry of a sister. Perhaps it was my zeal which caused me to become confrontational. I apologize as well.
As I said before, I still don't get the "stick thing", but there's a lot of things that I don't understand. Given the peril our children face, I don't want to take something useful away from those who minister to them.
You can rest assured that your brand of challenge is no more intimidating than it is inviting.
What Sis. Roxanne was doing was drawing a parallel between bringing things from the world into the church in order to keep our kids. If you honestly could not see her analogy was nothing like you portrayed it then I owe you an apology. You were not "intentionally" obtuse... just obtuse.
Just as an FYI... as I already stated... I was not taking a position on the issue... just the way Roxanne's post was being misconstrued. I personally enjoy the stick dramas and the dramatic interpretive signing like that done by Sis. Loida Howell. I am in favor of a certain measure of currency in dealing with our youth. I am not, however, in favor of trying to become so much like the world that our youth functions are indistinguishable from the local raves.
When you grow up, come on back and play and maybe we can have a decent conversation based on what is real and not what you perceive to be real!
Phil, are you saying that Roxanne is correct in using her analogy because she believes worldliness is being brought into the church? I'm puzzled because you say you enjoy such dramatics, but she deems them wrong and worldly. Do you not see a problem with that? Have you seen youth functions that are indistinguishable from the local raves?
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Obviously, we are not communicating and I really didn't intend to call names or offend. I just find it hard to believe that you don't see that there was no specific correlation between the drugs and the other activities. It was an analogy comparing the behavior of the responsible party in each case bringing in something traditionally viewed as harmful into a protected environment in an effort to keep the ones they were responsible for from going outside to do them.
Can you give an example of the above bolded portion that you refer to above? In this thread, we have talked about steppin and stick dramas, neither of which are known for bringing harm into a protected environment, traditional or otherwise.
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I've gone and done it now! I'm on Facebook!!!
*BREAKING NEWS*
Not everything new in our culture is "worldly" and damaging to the Christian lifestyle! There are harmless trends that can be used to help reach the younger generations.
*BACK TO YOUR REGULARLY SCHEDULED BICKERINGS!*
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