Whats The Point Of The Resurrection Of The Dead?

[Michael The Disciple]

When men or animals die they go to the same place.

12: Nevertheless man being in honour abideth not: he is like the beasts that perish.
13: This their way is their folly: yet their posterity approve their sayings. Selah.
14: Like sheep they are laid in the grave; death shall feed on them; and the upright shall have dominion over them in the morning; and their beauty shall consume in the grave from their dwelling. Psalms 49:12-14

Like sheep they are laid in THE GRAVE. The Hebrew for grave is SHEOL. The Greek word for Sheol is HADES.

Its important to understand grave, sheol, and hades are the same thing. It is the common place for the dead to be. Of course we are talking about souls dying. Whether they be men or animals.

When David spoke of Christs soul not being left in Hades this is the place he meant. It was a place where he went in death. The grave. A place from which souls must be resurrected if they would once again have life.

15: But God will redeem my soul from the power of the grave: for he shall receive me. Selah.

When did David think that would occur?

15: As for me, I will behold thy face in righteousness: I shall be satisfied, when I awake, with thy likeness. Psalms 17:15

Davids soul was in the grave. He said he would be satisfied when he AWOKE. How clear it becomes he thought in terms of his soul "sleeping" in the grave.

Only those who "sleep" can wake up.

[Michael The Disciple]

If Hades is a place where conscious souls of men go after they die what are ANIMALS doing there?

Note the reading of Psalms 49:10-15 in the LXX the Greek version of the Tanakh.



10 When he shall see wise men dying, the fool and the senseless one shall perish together; and they shall leave their wealth to strangers. 11 And their sepulchres are their houses for ever, even their tabernacles to all generations: they have called their lands after their own names. 12 And man being in honour, understands not: he is compared to the senseless cattle, and is like to them. 13 This their way is an offence to them: yet afterwards men will commend their sayings. Pause. 14 They have laid them as sheep in Hades; death shall feed on them; and the upright shall have dominion over them in the morning, and their help shall fail in Hades from their glory. 15 But God shall deliver my soul from the power of Hades, when he shall receive me. Pause.

Sheep along with men go to Hades when they die. Same place as David. Same place Yeshua was for three days until the resurrection.

Were the SHEEP also conscious there?

[easter]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Men and animals alike are souls. They are "breathing creatures"

21: And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw that it was good.

The word "creature" is NEPHESH the same exact Hebrew word that we translate as SOUL.

24: And God said, Let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind, cattle, and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after his kind: and it was so. Gen. 1:24

The earth brought forth living souls called animals!

Elohim made a covenant with men and animals after the flood. He said they were all SOULS.

10: And with every living creature [soul] that is with you, of the fowl, of the cattle, and of every beast of the earth with you; from all that go out of the ark, to every beast of the earth. Gen. 9:10

A soul is a living, breathing creature. Take away their breath and they die.

So Men and animals are alike?How do you come up with some of this?Ok first,God created the animals after their on kind(are you still with me?)Then he created man after his (God) own image.Here's the catch....

Man has a Body...
Man has a soul...
Man has a spirit...(Hey maybe this is the part that is in God's own image,God is Spirit,The word Image means to be like)
Let's examine this closer,shall we?

1 Thessalonians 5:23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly;and I pray God your WHOLE SPIRIT and Soul and Body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Body..Genesis 2:17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil,thou shalt not eat of it;for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

Soul...Leviticus 17:11 For the life of the flesh is in the blood;and I have given it to you upon the alter to make an atonement for your SOULS:for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the Souls.

Spirit...John 3:5-6-7 Jesus answered,verily,verily,I say unto thee,Except a man be born of water and of SPIRIT ,he cannot enter into the kingdom of Heaven.6.That which is born of flesh is flesh;and that which is born of the Spirit is Spirit.7.Marvel not that I said unto thee,Ye must be born again.


So I ask you this question quit a few post back and you did not answer,so I'll ask again.
What happens when a born again,Holy Spirit filled Christian dies,where does the Spirit that was born again inside the dead Christian go?If you say that the spirit sleeps a sleep of complete death.Then are you saying the Spirit by which this Christian was born again is dead until Jesus comes back?

[easter]

Really I should stop responding to your post because I already concluded that this discussion is only important to me for one reason.However it will not effect yours/mine(Salvation one bit)The reason is because it won't matter when I get to glory.Death will no longer even be a word we will use since there will be no one dying there.However I believe there will be some who will be so stubborn to this belief,they might very well refuse to get on up out of the grave to prove a point
If this is the case that only means more for me at the banquet feast:

[easter]

Ok that's not a fair question up there above...

Ok Michael let me try to explain this to you one last time,

When Jesus told Nicodemus that flesh was born of flesh.This is the soul.I have a soul,you have a soul and all living things that have breath in them have a soul...You are right up to this point.So when breath leaves a soul that is the life force of the soul.

Jesus told Nicodemus that in order to have eternal life a person has got to be born of the Spirit.

Flesh is born of the Flesh(Man born of Man)
Spirit is born of the Spirit(Spirit born of Holy Spirit)

What exactly is Jesus saying here?Don't worry, Nicodemus must have looked puzzled because Jesus told him Marvel not.
Jesus did not want Nicodemus to wonder at this because this is the very understanding for your salvation in Christ.

Jesus died to pay for all our sins.Sin is in the flesh.The only atonement for sin is through the blood of Christ.
Now Jesus told his disciples that unless he went to the Father the comforter would not come.The comforter is the Holy Spirit of God.
Before the Holy Spirit,people were still under the law and since sin is in the flesh the law could not cover the sin because sin is in the flesh.This right here is the very reason Jesus had to shed his blood to cover the sin.

Sin is why flesh and blood can not inherit the kingdom of Heaven.
OK...

So when the comforter (Holy Spirit came he filled the believers with his presence.So in order for the Holy Spirit to come into a person they have got to accept Jesus as their Lord and Savior.
When a person accepts Jesus the Holy Spirit will live in him and therefore the person is born again.Not of flesh but of the Holy Spirit.
The very Spirit of God living in each believer and giving eternal life to the born again Spirit of the believer.

Now when this person dies,their physical body dies but the very Spirit of God that gave life to the spirit in the dead believer will never die.The reason is this spirit of God(Holy Spirit) is how you were born of the Spirit(Child of God) and to say that the spirit dies and stays in the grave would be like saying God is slowly dying in each believer.

So in other words when sin enter the world so did death.The spirit is eternal and when sin enter the flesh so did death.God being spirit sent his son to cover the sin.God then sent the Holy Spirit to give back the eternal Spirit in a child of God.This born again spirit is for ever with the Lord the instant it leaves the sinful flesh.
The unbelievers also have a spirit but not of God.You see God gave each of his children a new spirit.God knows each of his children and searches the heart because he knows the spirit because it was born of him.
That is why he will tell the unsaved"Depart from me I never knew you.It's because he knows each and every one of his children because they are born again from God.

[mfblume]

Some instances of hell refer only to the grave. Others refer to an abode where people are quite conscious!

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Some instances of hell refer only to the grave. Others refer to an abode where people are quite conscious!

The word "hell" is just an English word for Sheol. The Greek word for Sheol is "Hades". So lets say Im addressing "Hades".

Do you believe that Hades ever is talking about the grave?

Why do animals go to Hades?

[mfblume]

Gehenna, Sheol , and Hades are all translated as hell. Animals got to he Hades/grave/hell, but Gehenna/hell is hellfire for sinners alone.

[easter]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

The word "hell" is just an English word for Sheol. The Greek word for Sheol is "Hades". So lets say Im addressing "Hades".

Do you believe that Hades ever is talking about the grave?

Why do animals go to Hades?

Why is there animals in Heaven?

[easter]

Originally Posted by easter

Why is there animals in Heaven?