Universal Health Care

[Ron]

Originally Posted by Ferd

This is a great point. One of the main reasons, European countries and Canada have the $$$$ to spend on socialist health care scemes is because they dont have to spen $$$$ on Military. We do it for them.


Maybe they should start paying us, then we could afford it too.

Ferd, we could spend more, but how much more?
What you guys spend on Defense is more than the Whole Canadian Federal Budget.

[Ron]

Originally Posted by embonpoint

1.4 trillion total over entire war as opposed to 1 trillion per year and growing.

You would have to define "winning".

I think it is winning.

You need to think again.

[scotty]

Originally Posted by Ron

Not qualified to post?

What qualifies oneself?

When they agree 100% with you?

I got no qualms with the military. My family has a long history on both sides of being involved both in the Air Force & Army.
Canada has troops in Afghanistan, almost every other day there is news of soldiers either being hurt or being killed.

In fact there is a debate in Parliament right mow about us willing to stay longer if other Nato countries getting involved-militarily.

What qualifications does one need?

You guys in the US getting rid of your Colonial Status from Great Britain-good on you.

How does the rest of the world view you going into the Middle East?
As just another oppressor-period.

You guys may feel you are the World's cop, but that doesn't make it so.

That is because the rest of the world doesn't have a clue. The rest of the world hides behind us. The rest of the world screams because we are in Iraqi, then crys out the same pie hole because we are not doing anything about Darfur. We didn't put ourselves here , the world did. Research your history Brother. It's the world that always looks to us for protection, its other countries that call on us when oppressed, it's here the people of the world come running to when they want out of their own country, the world call on us in WWI and WWII, Veitnam called us when the communist attacked. Other countries call us when they are hit with disasters. The world calls us when they can't do it on their own, then as our men and women die answering that call the same world bashes us for doing it. If your country has never asked for help nor recieved help from us then you may have reason to argue, otherwise I just assume the world say "thank you" and keep their hypocritical, ignorant and otherwise worthless comments to itself.

[scotty]

Originally Posted by Ron

You need to think again.

No thinking neccesary, facts have proved it , the surge is working.

[Ron]

Originally Posted by scotty

No thinking neccesary, facts have proved it , the surge is working.

I respectfully disagree!

[scotty]

Originally Posted by Ron

I respectfully disagree!

LOL, I could disagree that the world was round, lol

doesn't change the facts.

[Ron]

Originally Posted by scotty

LOL, I could disagree that the world was round, lol

doesn't change the facts.

Nor does Patriotic Propaganda either!

[scotty]

Originally Posted by Ron

Nor does Patriotic Propaganda either!

Are you kidding me, so all the statitics coming out of Iraqi is propaganda?!?! Even when the news agencies that are against the war report the same?!?!? I am still in touch with friends there.
Sorry Brother, your just highly opinionated, but you have no facts.

[OP_Carl]

Trickledown made some excellent points that Christopher Hall ignored:

Originally Posted by trickledown

I WOULD DEBATE THAT THE MAJORITY IS NOT IN FAVOR OF A SYSTEM LIKE YOURS OR FRANCES. AND NOW YOU HAVE ADDED WETHER OR NOT WE BELIEVE THAT ALL PEOPLE HAVE A RIGHT TO EAT. SCRIPTURE MAY BE SILENT ABOUT UNIVERSAL HEALTHCARE BUT IT DOES SPEAK TO FOOD.
2 Thessalonians 3:10 (King James Version)
King James Version (KJV)
Public Domain

10For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat.

THIS IS A WAKE UP TO EVERYONE READING THIS POST. THE SAME PEOPLE THAT THINK ALL SHOULD HAVE HEALTHCARE REGARDLESS OF ANY OTHER CIRCUMSTANCES WILL ALSO SOON ASK YOU TO FEED ALL REGARDLESS OF ANY CIRCUMSTANCES. THEIR IDEAS DO NOT FLY IN THE LIGHT OF SCRIPTURE. THE IDEAS THAT WERE PERPETUATED BY MARXIST ARE NOT CONGRUENT WITH THE IDEAS OF CHRIST.

I know that you have asked me to propose a workable solution instead of popping off from the sidelines with a long list of reasons why somebody else's proposal WON'T work. And that is exactly how I operate in the business world. However, I am not running for office, so my proposal is still in its draft phase. Maybe I'll get something together later.

You've also asked me for some more personal anecdotes and such. However, I am arguing from a set of principles, not appealing to sentiment.

Originally Posted by OP_Carl

A government that disregards the interests of the individual over the interests of the group when it comes to the collection of funds is ALSO going to disregard the interests of the individual over the interests of the group when it comes to the PAYOUT OF BENEFITS.

I can't emphasize this enough. The people that you're going to climb into bed with, politically speaking, in supporting national health care are going to turn around and cut your "Christian" throat just as soon as you've outlived your usefulness to their plans. Most people promoting national health care are doing so out of a true collectivist mindset or class envy. You "social gospel" people are a rarity. The business of group rights cuts both ways, and will eventually work against anybody who is not a committed secularist.

The communist manifesto has a term and a plan for people who can be convinced to cooperate with various steps of the master plan without being aware of the full implications or even the existence of the master plan itself. If you aren't familiar with it, suffice it to say that it is neither complimentary nor a term of endearment.

At the root, the socialist plan is to change the way Americans view themselves in terms of their rights, responsibilities, and most of all, their capabilities. The new paradigm will create an elite ruling class that treats the little people as children. It will include practices that will be counter to all kinds of Christian principles, but it will be too late for you to voice your opposition or affect change. The worst thing about it, from a Christian perspective, is that people will be harder to win to Christ when they've been raised from childhood to not take accountability for their own actions.

[embonpoint]

Originally Posted by Ron

You guys may feel you are the World's cop, but that doesn't make it so.

Nor does believing the guy behind you with the red and blue lights and the gun and cuffs is not a cop mean he's not. Probably wouldn't be a good defense in court and certainly isn't going to keep you out of the hoosegow when you do finally pull over.