Local Church BODY

[Michlow]

Originally Posted by Coonskinner

I said nothing, absolutely nothing, about rules.

I just don't see how you or anyone can figure on getting to know Jesus and bypass the very things He has set in order to help you along the way.

Until I trust and love Him, why would I care about his rules??? That is my point! If I don't know who he is, or even like the guy, why would I want to listen to him?

How can I trust or follow anyone else when I can't trust or follow him?

I have tried it your way. I have listened to several different men, all of whom couldn't agree or told me contradicting things, or just plain told me things that were wrong (like I should divorce my husband and find myself a good Christian man, for one).

And you may not have said anything about rules...but what exactly am I supposed to "obey" from the Pastor if not "the rules"?

I am starting to get frustrated! I feel like you are all asking me to do calculus, when I haven't even figured out basic math.

I understand the concern. Trust me, I have it coming out of my ears. Through PM's and emails and phone calls. And I appreciate it, I really do. I am happy that you guys care about me, and are worried about my spiritual condition; but let me ask this: If I was a brand new person coming to your church, who only had a vague and misrepresented view of Jesus, would you start hounding me on pastor authority, and doctrine? Or would you just try to show me Jesus?

You would think that I am advocating some gross sin or immorality or turning into that carlton pearson guy or some other fruit job, when all I am really asking is to find out who Jesus is.

Am I really doing something crazy in wanting to serve a God that I love and trust, and not one who I think is a BFM?

[Whole Hearted]

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

Good. I would say more but for right now I will hold my peace. Really I have said enough. Any preacher has dealt with the Tribe of Roamers throughout their ministry and they are so predictable and the end for them and their families are so sad, but a preacher can't help anyone who does not want any help.

This is so true. I have dealt with this type before and they always end in shipwreck.

[Rico]

Originally Posted by Whole Hearted

This is so true. I have dealt with this type before and they always end in shipwreck.

Classic example. When a preacher says, "I have dealt with this type before and they always end in shipwreck" their words and attitude are holy and righteous. When someone that's been lied to more than once says, "I have dealt with this kind of preacher before and it always ends in shipwreck" they're lost, preacher haters, on the slippery slope, and headed straight for hell.

[Whole Hearted]

Originally Posted by Rico

Classic example. When a preacher says, "I have dealt with this type before and they always end in shipwreck" their words and attitude are holy and righteous. When someone that's been lied to more than once says, "I have dealt with this kind of preacher before and it always ends in shipwreck" they're lost, preacher haters, on the slippery slope, and headed straight for hell.

I've been lied to and lied on many times.

I have saw people who would not be pastored and ever time they had a tragic end.

[OGIA]

Originally Posted by Twisp

I'm not looking for technicalities, what I said was true. The verse makes a clear distinction when it says "preacher". I do believe a preacher is needed to be saved, according to this scripture. I merely find it odd that he said preacher instead of pastor.

Originally Posted by Coonskinner

That isn't the only verse in the Bible.

The perfecting of the saints cannot be accomplished without the five fold ministry.

The context of the verse you cite is the initial hearing of the Gospel.

That is just the beginning.

I sure hope this forum realizes how blessed it is to have a man who rightly divides the word of truth!

[COOPER]

Originally Posted by Michlow

Until I trust and love Him, why would I care about his rules??? That is my point! If I don't know who he is, or even like the guy, why would I want to listen to him?

How can I trust or follow anyone else when I can't trust or follow him?

I have tried it your way. I have listened to several different men, all of whom couldn't agree or told me contradicting things, or just plain told me things that were wrong (like I should divorce my husband and find myself a good Christian man, for one).

And you may not have said anything about rules...but what exactly am I supposed to "obey" from the Pastor if not "the rules"?

I am starting to get frustrated! I feel like you are all asking me to do calculus, when I haven't even figured out basic math.

I understand the concern. Trust me, I have it coming out of my ears. Through PM's and emails and phone calls. And I appreciate it, I really do. I am happy that you guys care about me, and are worried about my spiritual condition; but let me ask this: If I was a brand new person coming to your church, who only had a vague and misrepresented view of Jesus, would you start hounding me on pastor authority, and doctrine? Or would you just try to show me Jesus?

You would think that I am advocating some gross sin or immorality or turning into that carlton pearson guy or some other fruit job, when all I am really asking is to find out who Jesus is.

Am I really doing something crazy in wanting to serve a God that I love and trust, and not one who I think is a BFM?

Mich, good heart felt post.

[nathan_slatter]

Originally Posted by Michlow

You would think that I am advocating some gross sin or immorality or turning into that carlton pearson guy or some other fruit job, when all I am really asking is to find out who Jesus is.

Sometimes Jesus comes with a bunch of unnecessary baggage. From preemptive ideologies to complete misunderstanding to complete misinterpretation. Jesus, often, comes with baggage. The idea is to drop all of the baggage realizing that it is our own, given to us by everyone that has influenced our spirituality. In the end, following Jesus is a personal quest -- one that can, and should be, traveled among a crowd but, many times, even within the crowd, the quest can be lonely.

Keep seeking Jesus, you'll find him. He said so.

[Sherri]

Michelle--I'll be praying for you. I think you're on a search for truth, and you will find it if you listen to God and God alone. That doesn't mean you don't need a good church, because I am a big church advocate - you know that. God will lead you to the right house and you will once again be in fellowship, with the people where He leads you.

If God leads you back to a UPC church, by all means, run to it and don't look back. But if He leads you elsewhere, listen to His voice and not the voice of men. God is your ultimate authority, but I do believe you need the voice of a shepherd in your life too.

[Old Paths]

PREACHER-HATER

PREACHER (prē'chər)

Preacher (One who preaches, especially one who publicly proclaims the gospel for an occupation.)



HATE (hāt)

v., hat·ed, hat·ing, hates.

A person that hates (1. feels hostility or animosity toward 2. To feel dislike or distaste for)

Preacher-Hater One who feels hostility, animosity, feels dislike or distastes toward one who preaches, especially one who publicly proclaims the gospel for an occupation.

[Carpenter]

Originally Posted by Old Paths

PREACHER-HATER

PREACHER (prē'chər)

Preacher (One who preaches, especially one who publicly proclaims the gospel for an occupation.)



HATE (hāt)

v., hat·ed, hat·ing, hates.

A person that hates (1. feels hostility or animosity toward 2. To feel dislike or distaste for)

Preacher-Hater One who feels hostility, animosity, feels dislike or distastes toward one who preaches, especially one who publicly proclaims the gospel for an occupation.

Hey, if you are going to hijack a thread and totally post something that is totally irrelevant, go start your own thread why dontcha !!!!?????