Emergent Church

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by edjen01

fair enough. and even while i may agree with his point...no man should EVER joke/kid/TIC/or whatever about raping someone. It's simply not acceptable no matter where you're from!! And someone who is in higher education should understand this.

I have e-mailed him about some of that, but he just laughs. Anyway, yes, I do agree with you. If he is professing to be a Christian, he should be careful how he pushes his wording, but I'm sure he won't.

He has been very extensively involved in political wrangling and the left asking for his head, so I think that may be part of why he is a little caustic. Not an excuse, but I know when you immerse yourself in that environment, to any lengthy extent, it's going to affect you. You can become just as viral, if you are not careful.

I think that Ann Coulter makes very good points and is not afraid to push buttons, but she can also go over the top with it too.

[edjen01]

does Dr.Adams profess to be a Christian?

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Sam

Isn't one of the meanings of "emerge" to "crawl out from under"
and
isn't it time for the church to emerge or crawl out from under the doctrines and traditions of men that we have tried to cover her with, bury her under, stifle her voice with, and suffocate her through?

Depends on the direction they are crawling to "emerge". That is probably Mike's point, IMO.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by edjen01

does Dr.Adams profess to be a Christian?

Yes, he does. But I was a Cathoholic at one time. LOL! Just sayin'. At least he's not an atheist anymore. He's emerging...... LOL!

[Pressing-On]

John 14:6 For Dummies
Mike Adams

There is a powerful tendency these days for men to want to appear to be, above all things, tolerant. But G.K. Chesterton said it best when he said that tolerance is the virtue of a man without convictions. It might also be said that tolerance is the virtue of a man without salvation. Every man must choose between Truth and tolerance. He cannot choose both and expect to dine at the Great Supper.

http://townhall.com/Common/PrintPage...1719e51314&t=c

I'm starting to look like his disciple. LOL! I'm just saying that he's making some relevant points, IMO.

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

Sorry, Pel. I don't agree with your assessment of Mike. His comment - "...a watered-down version of Christianity that appeals to people who want a little religion but have no desire to change their behavior." - is what the majority are seeing around us. It doesn't matter what the IHOP thing is doing. We are looking at the majority example.

He wrote a piece about Joel Osteen, (cited below) which was surprising. I did like that article as well. I've followed him for some time and he mainly was hitting the political establishment. Now he is commenting here and I'm interested as to what a "non-conservative/non-organizational" person is observing. That is my interest in Mike's articles/blogs.

I have to confess that the Joel Osteens of the world (who isn't even really a part of the "Emergent" thing - he's one of the "mega-church" guys) don't impact me much - but then again, he's closer to your neighborhood than mine. And, I have tried to watch Larry King - but the guy's so boring he makes my eyes bleed.

So with full admission that your examples of this "watered down Christianity" aren't even on my radar - I still disagree to a point.

The "Emergent Church" thing was kicked off by a general dissatisfaction with the "watered down" experience many people were finding in their "mega-church" theme parks. Lumping Osteen in with the "Emergents" actually shows how uninformed this criticism is. It's almost like saying the Pope is what is wrong with the Amish way of life. - - not quite that extreme, but it's the same critter.

The "emergents" emphasize a passion for the Christian walk. The "mega churches" stamp out disciples with a cookie cutter. There are many different flavors and varieties of each - but they are two different classes of church experience.

AND, those in the UPC and other OP's who have implemented some of the "emergent" features have not been "easy believism" advocates. They have taken some rather strident stands. We may either agree or disagree with them, but we can't dismiss their passion.

[*AQuietPlace*]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

I agree with one of his points, as I've observed this very thing:

"...a watered-down version of Christianity that appeals to people who want a little religion but have no desire to change their behavior."

I agree that there are people who simply want a little religion, and not really have a changed life. But I don't agree that 'rules' are the answer, as he seems to imply. You can have all the rules you want and not have a changed heart.

Imo, the real key is relationship (not rules). Because if you have real relationship, you will begin to change. Your life will be transformed. With rules, it's way too easy to be complacent. 'I've checked off the list, I'm holy now. Don't have to think about it anymore'. Real relationship with Jesus will challenge you on every level of your life.

A real relationship will check your spirit when the clerk at the grocery store gives you too much change back. I've walked all the way back into the store when I discovered that a candy bar I had in the grocery cart wasn't scanned. There was no rule that told me I had to do that, but the prick in my heart did. I had a clerk at the bank give me several hundred dollars in cash that didn't belong to me, and then argue with me when I told her it wasn't mine! It would have been very easy to say 'thank you' and rejoice about how the Lord had blessed me! (not) But a relationship with Jesus will guide you in these situations.

We've all had times when we've had to forgive, when we've had to bite our tongue, when we've had to resist evil thoughts, love our neighbor when it was hard to do so. And it's real relationship that helps us to do that. Not so much 'rules'.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by pelathais

I have to confess that the Joel Osteens of the world (who isn't even really a part of the "Emergent" thing - he's one of the "mega-church" guys) don't impact me much - but then again, he's closer to your neighborhood than mine. And, I have tried to watch Larry King - but the guy's so boring he makes my eyes bleed.

So with full admission that your examples of this "watered down Christianity" aren't even on my radar - I still disagree to a point.

The "Emergent Church" thing was kicked off by a general dissatisfaction with the "watered down" experience many people were finding in their "mega-church" theme parks. Lumping Osteen in with the "Emergents" actually shows how uninformed this criticism is. It's almost like saying the Pope is what is wrong with the Amish way of life. - - not quite that extreme, but it's the same critter.

The "emergents" emphasize a passion for the Christian walk. The "mega churches" stamp out disciples with a cookie cutter. There are many different flavors and varieties of each - but they are two different classes of church experience.

AND, those in the UPC and other OP's who have implemented some of the "emergent" features have not been "easy believism" advocates. They have taken some rather strident stands. We may either agree or disagree with them, but we can't dismiss their passion.

We've made progress in our exchange when you can say, "I disagree to a point." LOL!

I think you may, in some cases (IHOP? 'cause I'm not sure. Haven't studied them out), have a valid point with your terms cited, i.e., "mega churches", "emergents", easy believism", and "watered-down Christianity", but, I think, in many cases by personal observation, they appear to intersect and are not always majorly exclusive.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by *AQuietPlace*

I agree that there are people who simply want a little religion, and not really have a changed life. But I don't agree that 'rules' are the answer, as he seems to imply. You can have all the rules you want and not have a changed heart.
wasn't mine! It would have been very easy to say 'thank you' and rejoice about how the Lord had blessed me! (not) But a relationship with Jesus will guide you in these situations.

I agree, but that is not Mike's point.

[*AQuietPlace*]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

I have e-mailed him about some of that, but he just laughs. Anyway, yes, I do agree with you. If he is professing to be a Christian, he should be careful how he pushes his wording, but I'm sure he won't.

Sounds like he's doing just what he's accused others of doing. Not changing his behavior.