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View Poll Results: Do You Believe in Women Preachers?
Yes 128 62.75%
No 55 26.96%
Don't Care 21 10.29%
Voters: 204. You may not vote on this poll

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  #1271  
Old 02-05-2011, 12:17 PM
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Esther Esther is offline
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Re: Do You Believe In Women Preachers?

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Originally Posted by paul kimrey View Post
Maybe a better name for the thred would be do you agree with the unBiblical concept of a woman preaching
The problem I see here is men that want to decide what the bible means and that their understanding is the only right one.

I am more than convinced you are wrong.
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  #1272  
Old 02-05-2011, 01:25 PM
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Re: Do You Believe In Women Preachers?

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Originally Posted by paul kimrey View Post
1Timothy 2:12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. Read chapter 2 and 3 you will see that Paul was teaching Timothy about church protocol and the qualifications for the ministry.When a woman teaches or usurps authority over the man she has gotten out of the natural order that God set up for the ministry. The reason that no qualifications were established for female preachers is that they were not recognized by Paul.You don't find women preaching in the book of Acts or any laying on of hands by the presbytery for ordination.Women can have all kinds of ministries as long as they don't teach or usurp authority of the man.They can be used to operate the gifts of the spirit, older women can teach younger women, they can teach children , they can prophesy/ not preach but fore tell of things to come. The rules were laid out by Apostle Paul in a plain easy to understand format that does not require a phd in theology to understand. Priscilla helped expound the Word more plainly to Paul in her home/kitchen table type setting not pulpit type ministry.Deborah was a Judge over Israel still not a New Testament pulpit ministry.When the eleven went out to perform the great commission they did not ordain women to preach.I would never hold license with any organization that would so blatantly disregard the Word of God in favor of man made doctrine.
Trust me, you're wasting your time w/ this bunch, as is well known throughout Apostolic ranks. Sad...honestly......RDP.
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  #1273  
Old 02-05-2011, 01:32 PM
rdp rdp is offline
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Re: Do You Believe In Women Preachers?

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Originally Posted by Austin View Post
Well here it is again the question, What do you believe? In reality it doesn't make any difference what I believe or what someone else believes. People have the tendency to believe whatever they want. What's important is what does the Bible say!
I Corinthians Chapter14 deals with the confusion that is going on in the church and has been passed to Paul in a letter requesting his reply. He replys the answer directly to just that. The Order in The Church. Pauls does not address the ministry of Jesus in the world pertaining to a woman'scalling because he can't without contridicting what the Prophet Joel fortold.( Acts Chapter 2 verses; 17 and 18 It states once the Holy Ghost is poured out in the last days the result will be, sons and DAUGHTERS shall prophesy and, HANDMAIDENS will prophesy.Prophesy is not only declaring the future by the direction of God, prophesy is declaring God's word. It covers past, present, and future content.
Paul said in the church, verse,34.Let your women keep SILENCE.this means to be still and calm and under control. If the word was silent then it means, don't say anything.the other half of that verse states, commanded to be under obedience, which means under control of their husband.
I think this verse is one that is quick read and very misinterrupted.
In verse 35 Paul says it is a shame for a woman to speak in the church. Now there is no way literally Paul is saying women can't say anything while at church. Both of these verses has nothing to do with preaching but has everything to do with the out of control situation that was going on at that location.
Neither does this section of the Bible address the position of a Pastor. There is only one area that gives the qualification and that is only intended to a man of God. Men are the head of the church of our Lord Jesus as they are the head of the woman.
But thanks be unto our Lord and Savior for the detication of women in the churches down through the ages or half of the current churches would not even be here. Praise to His Holy Name!!!!
Quite sure this is to no avail, but the word "speak" in vs. 34 is alternately translated as "preach" 6x's in the NT! THIS is what women are forbidden to do "when you come together". Anna was not taking a text & expounding from the written Word of God to men in a church setting, as is done today [so I hear].

Also, Prophecy is defined primarily as to "spontaneously reveal the hidden truths of God." While blindfolded, they asked Jesus, "PROPHECY to us, thou Christ, who smote thee". Did they expect Christ to preach a sermon to them...or to reveal what couldn't be seen w/ the natural eye...here's your sign.....
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  #1274  
Old 02-05-2011, 01:38 PM
rdp rdp is offline
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Re: Do You Believe In Women Preachers?

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Originally Posted by paul kimrey View Post
Women pastors / preachers? What does the Bible say about women in ministry?

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women pastors, women preachers

Question: "Women pastors / preachers? What does the Bible say about women in ministry?"

Answer: There is perhaps no more hotly debated issue in the church today than the issue of women serving as pastors/preachers. As a result, it is very important to not see this issue as men versus women. There are women who believe women should not serve as pastors and that the Bible places restrictions on the ministry of women, and there are men who believe women can serve as preachers and that there are no restrictions on women in ministry. This is not an issue of chauvinism or discrimination. It is an issue of biblical interpretation.

The Word of God proclaims, “A woman should learn in quietness and full submission. I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent” (1 Timothy 2:11-12). In the church, God assigns different roles to men and women. This is a result of the way mankind was created and the way in which sin entered the world (1 Timothy 2:13-14). God, through the apostle Paul, restricts women from serving in roles of teaching and/or having spiritual authority over men. This precludes women from serving as pastors over men, which definitely includes preaching to, teaching, and having spiritual authority.

There are many “objections” to this view of women in ministry. A common one is that Paul restricts women from teaching because in the first century, women were typically uneducated. However, 1 Timothy 2:11-14 nowhere mentions educational status. If education were a qualification for ministry, the majority of Jesus' disciples would not have been qualified. A second common objection is that Paul only restricted the women of Ephesus from teaching (1 Timothy was written to Timothy, who was the pastor of the church in Ephesus). The city of Ephesus was known for its temple to Artemis, a false Greek/Roman goddess. Women were the authority in the worship of Artemis. However, the book of 1 Timothy nowhere mentions Artemis, nor does Paul mention Artemis worship as a reason for the restrictions in 1 Timothy 2:11-12.

A third common objection is that Paul is only referring to husbands and wives, not men and women in general. The Greek words in the passage could refer to husbands and wives; however, the basic meaning of the words refers to men and women. Further, the same Greek words are used in verses 8-10. Are only husbands to lift up holy hands in prayer without anger and disputing (verse 8)? Are only wives to dress modestly, have good deeds, and worship God (verses 9-10)? Of course not. Verses 8-10 clearly refer to all men and women, not only husbands and wives. There is nothing in the context that would indicate a switch to husbands and wives in verses 11-14.

Yet another frequent objection to this interpretation of women in ministry is in relation to women who held positions of leadership in the Bible, specifically Miriam, Deborah, and Huldah in the Old Testament. This objection fails to note some significant factors. First, Deborah was the only female judge among 13 male judges. Huldah was the only female prophet among dozens of male prophets mentioned in the Bible. Miriam's only connection to leadership was being the sister of Moses and Aaron. The two most prominent women in the times of the Kings were Athaliah and Jezebel—hardly examples of godly female leadership. Most significantly, though, the authority of women in the Old Testament is not relevant to the issue. The book of 1 Timothy and the other Pastoral Epistles present a new paradigm for the church—the body of Christ—and that paradigm involves the authority structure for the church, not for the nation of Israel or any other Old Testament entity.

Similar arguments are made using Priscilla and Phoebe in the New Testament. In Acts 18, Priscilla and Aquila are presented as faithful ministers for Christ. Priscilla's name is mentioned first, perhaps indicating that she was more “prominent” in ministry than her husband. However, Priscilla is nowhere described as participating in a ministry activity that is in contradiction to 1 Timothy 2:11-14. Priscilla and Aquila brought Apollos into their home and they both discipled him, explaining the Word of God to him more accurately (Acts 18:26).

In Romans 16:1, even if Phoebe is considered a “deaconess” instead of a “servant,” that does not indicate that Phoebe was a teacher in the church. “Able to teach” is given as a qualification for elders, but not deacons (1 Timothy 3:1-13; Titus 1:6-9). Elders/bishops/deacons are described as the “husband of one wife,” “a man whose children believe,” and “men worthy of respect.” Clearly the indication is that these qualifications refer to men. In addition, in 1 Timothy 3:1-13 and Titus 1:6-9, masculine pronouns are used exclusively to refer to elders/bishops/deacons.

The structure of 1 Timothy 2:11-14 makes the “reason” perfectly clear. Verse 13 begins with “for” and gives the “cause” of Paul’s statement in verses 11-12. Why should women not teach or have authority over men? Because “Adam was created first, then Eve. And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived.” God created Adam first and then created Eve to be a “helper” for Adam. This order of creation has universal application in the family (Ephesians 5:22-33) and the church. The fact that Eve was deceived is also given as a reason for women not serving as pastors or having spiritual authority over men. This leads some to believe that women should not teach because they are more easily deceived. That concept is debatable, but if women are more easily deceived, why should they be allowed to teach children (who are easily deceived) and other women (who are supposedly more easily deceived)? That is not what the text says. Women are not to teach men or have spiritual authority over men because Eve was deceived. As a result, God has given men the primary teaching authority in the church.

Many women excel in gifts of hospitality, mercy, teaching, evangelism, and helps. Much of the ministry of the local church depends on women. Women in the church are not restricted from public praying or prophesying (1 Corinthians 11:5), only from having spiritual teaching authority over men. The Bible nowhere restricts women from exercising the gifts of the Holy Spirit (1 Corinthians 12). Women, just as much as men, are called to minister to others, to demonstrate the fruit of the Spirit (Galatians 5:22-23), and to proclaim the gospel to the lost (Matthew 28:18-20; Acts 1:8; 1 Peter 3:15).

God has ordained that only men are to serve in positions of spiritual teaching authority in the church. This is not because men are necessarily better teachers, or because women are inferior or less intelligent (which is not the case). It is simply the way God designed the church to function. Men are to set the example in spiritual leadership—in their lives and through their words. Women are to take a less authoritative role. Women are encouraged to teach other women (Titus 2:3-5). The Bible also does not restrict women from teaching children. The only activity women are restricted from is teaching or having spiritual authority over men. This logically would preclude women from serving as pastors to men. This does not make women less important, by any means, but rather gives them a ministry focus more in agreement with God’s plan and His gifting of them
I have this book & it's the absolute best & most detailed I've ever read on the subject. The only way one could still believe in "women preacher's" after reading this is to outright deny the grammatical & biblical facts...which flows into area's of dishonesty. May God lead "women preacher's" in the church to heart-felt, honest repentance.
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  #1275  
Old 02-05-2011, 01:45 PM
rdp rdp is offline
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Re: Do You Believe In Women Preachers?

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Originally Posted by paul kimrey View Post
my old pastor had a saying that fits this discussion pretty well[ if you don't like that scripture tear it out, before long you'll have a Bible you can obey]
Wise man...The reason I fight "women preachers" so hard is many have no problem condemning women to hell for cutting their hair [I agree] "since it is a shame/disgrace"....yet the same apostle Paul, in the same book, uses the same Greek word "shame/disgrace" for "women to speak 'Lal-eh-o' in the church." The Greek word for "Speak" is "Lal-eh-o" which is translated as "preach" 6x's elsewhere!

There's far more Scripture against "women preachers" than there is women cutting their hair...though that's also certainly valid. So, some will embrace the one & explain away the other! Pure hypocrisy......
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  #1276  
Old 02-05-2011, 01:48 PM
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Re: Do You Believe In Women Preachers?

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Originally Posted by Esther View Post
The problem I see here is men that want to decide what the bible means and that their understanding is the only right one.

I am more than convinced you are wrong.
Too funny....this coming from a woman....go figure!

So, we're "wrong," but "our understanding is the only right one" ???
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  #1277  
Old 02-05-2011, 01:51 PM
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Re: Do You Believe In Women Preachers?

rdp, do you work as Sister Alvear in the Kingdom? Until then, maybe the mirror analogy should be used.
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  #1278  
Old 02-05-2011, 01:54 PM
rdp rdp is offline
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Re: Do You Believe In Women Preachers?

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Originally Posted by paul kimrey View Post
I think the UPC has completely gone off the deep end by licensing women to preach
Personally [& I know many men like this], if I'm in a service where a woman gets up to "preach/teach" the service, we just get up & graciously leave w/out making a big scene.

I wouldn't sit there & listen to a trinitarian teach his false doctrines, why should I sit for false doctrine from anyone else? Simply put, I'll not be forced to disobey the plain written Word of God.
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  #1279  
Old 02-05-2011, 01:56 PM
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Re: Do You Believe In Women Preachers?

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Originally Posted by UnTraditional View Post
rdp, do you work as Sister Alvear in the Kingdom? Until then, maybe the mirror analogy should be used.
Of course I highly respect Sis. Alvear for her sacrifices, but do you work as "Mother Theresa" did? Until then, maybe the mirror analogy should be used!

Or, will you now embrace Catholicism? Ever heard of the fallacy, "Irrelevant Appeal Outside of the Text"? What's amusing is your moniker "Untraditional," then you defend the very thing you claim to not be.....tradition!

Last edited by rdp; 02-05-2011 at 01:59 PM.
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  #1280  
Old 02-05-2011, 02:04 PM
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Esther Esther is offline
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Re: Do You Believe In Women Preachers?

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Originally Posted by rdp View Post
Too funny....this coming from a woman....go figure!

So, we're "wrong," but "our understanding is the only right one" ???
I'm sure a man would have trouble recognizing that God can use a woman, after all he could use a donkey.

Let me ask you this, IF God said a woman is not to preach, then tell me why has he anointed them when they preach?
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