The [Apostolic] Prosperity Gospel

[AreYouReady?]

A few years ago, I happened to come across a forum site for UPCI ministers only. There was a man on there trying to get some of the ministers to give him scriptures for tithing. What was given was the same stuff we hear all the time. But to the ministers on the forum, I got the feeling it was that the people "owe" it to them.

The administrator must have gotten tired of his questions because they banned him for trying to discuss the tithe.

They shut him up by not allowing him on their forum.

[Jason B]

Originally Posted by AreYouReady?

A few years ago, I happened to come across a forum site for UPCI ministers only. There was a man on there trying to get some of the ministers to give him scriptures for tithing. What was given was the same stuff we hear all the time. But to the ministers on the forum, I got the feeling it was that the people "owe" it to them.

The administrator must have gotten tired of his questions because they banned him for trying to discuss the tithe.

They shut him up by not allowing him on their forum.

Did that forum happen to be AMF?

[AreYouReady?]

Actually, I don't remember the name of the forum except that it was for UPCI ministers only. Several of them were rather .... condescending to the young man.

[houston]

the upci did have forums on upci dot com several yrs ago. they did have a section for ministers only.

[Jason B]

Originally Posted by AreYouReady?

Actually, I don't remember the name of the forum except that it was for UPCI ministers only. Several of them were rather .... condescending to the young man.

http://apostolicfriendsforum.com/sho...t=28665&page=2

[houston]

he said that it was only for upci ministers, did not say it was for UCons only.

[AreYouReady?]

It has been awhile but I seem to remember that one of the ministers was giving the poster a subtle "warning" that he would be banned if he kept this (the tithing subject) up.

If that happened to you, then this must be the forum.

My husband and I read the entire exchange and I remember how angry he got at the minister's responses to the young man. And hey, I don't know why we got the idea he was a young man...maybe it was because none of the older ministers ever dare to buck the tithing system???

[Jason B]

Originally Posted by *AQuietPlace*

I never said there wasn't a difference in the theology. But if you want to be HEARD you may need to alter your terminology. It's basic communication.

I typed a post that took me 40 minutes and then tried to post it and was told I wasn't logged in and lost the whole thing. What a bummer.

Long and short of it, they are not going to hear. The information I have to share is common to anyone who has studied even basic church history or read even the most basic Bible commentary such as Thru the Bible with J. vernon Mcgee or the Be Series by Warren Wiersbe. Or much more studied commentaries such as those by G. Campbell Morgan, F.F. Bruce and john MacArthur.

Basically if they're not going to hear John MacArthur, perhaps the most well respected living Bible teacher and certainly one of the leaders of evangelical christianity in our times, then they aren't going to listen to me. If they are not willing to hear Martin Luther, John Wesley, Charles Spurgeon, John Huss, etc,etc,etc, they are not going to hear me.

One of these ministers who is prominent grew up (as far as I understand) NOT believing in tithing. most people nowdays do not realize that many pentecostal/apostolic churches DID NOT believe in tithing for a very long time. Thats not something widely mentioned. It really wasn't until the pentecostals mirrored the traditional denominations, with buildings like the rest and instutions like the rest that the majority of churches accepted tithing.

Anyway, as for my being heard, I'm being heard on here. On google. My tithing threads on AFF have generated thousands and thousands of views, so someone is hearing. Occasionally i get messages from strangers on the topic because they came across some of my posts on the internet so thats good enough for me.

The reason I am so adamant is not to chagne the church. i've studied enough Christian history to see that NEVER works out. Luther wanted to remain in the Catholic Church, Wesley wanted to remian in the Church of England, and the same can be said for basically the head of every new branch of Christianity since the reformation. Reformation from within doesn't historically work. Thats not the reason i am so adamant. I am not such a stickler becuae I don't want people paying tithes. If someone wants to pay tithes, let them pay tithes. If they want to give 20%, 30% have at it. Most middle class families in America can afford tithes, its not a burden to them. Its a little different when preaching to the very poorest in society, or when preaching in thrid world countries or Islamic regimes where christians are oppressed. And thats why I am so adamantly against tithing, because it destroys the poor and lower class people. Again I say to them it makes God a lein holder and a landlord. A diety who must be approached and appeased by the giving of money. It makes salvation by corruptible things like silver and gold, rather than the precious blood of Christ. It denies the biblical theology of grace and rips the tithe out of the Mosaic law. It denies the New Testament model of eldership in the church and a plurality of bishops ALL of whom were equals (and equally to be supported as taught in 1 Timothy 5;17), denies the priesthood of the believer (thus the right to be supported by tithes), often forgets the poor, needy, widows, and orphans-OR gives only a small percentage to such causes while the lions share goes to one man, and more than anything destroys the character of God by making Him vindictive towards anyone in noncompliance after the examples of Achan, Ananias, and Saphrrira, which results in many people serving God through fear, and even destoying the faith of some for the sake of money. both the former is especially evident in basically every tithing thread in the history of AFF.

[Titus2woman]

Originally Posted by Jason Badejo

I am so adamantly against tithing, because it destroys the poor and lower class people. Again I say to them it makes God a lein holder and a landlord. A diety who must be approached and appeased by the giving of money. It makes salvation by corruptible things like silver and gold, rather than the precious blood of Christ. It denies the biblical theology of grace and rips the tithe out of the Mosaic law. It denies the New Testament model of eldership in the church and a plurality of bishops ALL of whom were equals (and equally to be supported as taught in 1 Timothy 5;17), denies the priesthood of the believer (thus the right to be supported by tithes), often forgets the poor, needy, widows, and orphans-OR gives only a small percentage to such causes while the lions share goes to one man, and more than anything destroys the character of God by making Him vindictive towards anyone in noncompliance after the examples of Achan, Ananias, and Saphrrira, which results in many people serving God through fear, and even destoying the faith of some for the sake of money. both the former is especially evident in basically every tithing thread in the history of AFF.

Amen and Amen!

[Hoovie]

Jason, you have a good grasp on the subject I think. Very balanced too, because you are not trying squeeze money from church offerings particularly.

You should consider writing a small book on the matter. I think I know a few folks who would help finance it if you are interested.