Let's see what 'Spiritual Wisdom' we really have Available...

Originally Posted by NLYP

Bro Doug,
I have taken the last few days and pondered your question about the dear lady in your church with the matted hair problem.
I have found controversy in my own heart about this and I will share what I think. NOW PLEASE hear me well. I am not here to sway or make fun of any mans convictions on hair. IF you are for no cutting or trimming or whatever...GREAT I respect you!

Having said that here goes...
I have met many men in our organization that hold a strong position on hair. Some even to the point where cutting it would be a heaven or hell issue. IF you or this dear sister agree with that type of thinking then you have a MAJOR problem. Things that are truly heaven or hell would be equivolent to the very act of sin. So having said that, it would imply that you would believe that cutting or trimming this ladys hair would be a "sin".
The problem I see with this is since when would "sin" be ok if it is required to do because of a medical condition?
If that were true, one could say that abortion or murder would be justified in the case of the health of the mother or a result of rape.

Where the problem in a situation like this lies in in the thinking of the whole hair issue...is it a salvational madate...a principle or a traditional custom?

IF one holds to the salvational importance of uncut hair then in NO way would this lady be allowed to cut out the tangles for the purpose of her eternal reward.
If an exception like that is made with the thinking of salvational precedednce, then you out yourself into the position of saying that slavational issues can be overlooked in the time of medical or physical needs.
Example....an invalid that cannot leave his wheelchair or bed to get into the water for baptism.

This is one of the dilemas I see with making holiness standards salvational mandates.

#2,
If you hold that it is a principle then I can see room for a priciple to be understood, yet have the ability to "bend" in cases like this. Because it is not an issue that would damage hersalvational position, it would just be a question of the heart that would say.....God I love you and I love the principles of your word....but I need to start over with my hair because of my circumstances. NOT ONLY would God hear that cry, but I believe he would honor it as well.

#3,
If it is a traditional custom.....Cut it off and start over.

I hope you see my point. We need to be SOOOO careful what we put under the label of "salvational" or "heaven or hell" because it sets us up for situations like this where we are FORCED to stand and say....sorry sis its sin, you will have to just deal the cards you have been given....or realize that these things are NOT sin and are let the lady feel in her heart what her realtionship with a merciful God would dictate.

I a love long hair......BUT I would NEVER teach or preach it to the level of Acts 2:38.

I would, if I were in your shoes, take this dear saint of God aside and tell her that God understands and it will be ok to out the "temple" back in order again.

I think I saw somebody say that they should cut it and hide it in a way that nobody knows.

HOGWASH!
Thats basically saying...we really dont approve of the sin so lets hide it.
Baloney....God is merciful and we should be as well.

My Brothers I love you all dearly.
Lets fight the fight together!

just my thoughts from my heart..

Bro. Dan

Bro. Christenson,

Rather than go into a lengthy dialogue leading into another 'famous' hair standards thread let me 'cut' (pardon the pun) to the chase by telling you that I am, indeed, one of those who preach uncut hair is important. It is my conviction and one that I have maintained throughout my ministry for the Church I Pastor.

Should someone else cut their hair then I'll leave that to their Pastor but I find that cutting your hair as rebellion to the teachings of your spiritual Shepherd sinful. Yes. Obviously some will launch upon that like rabid wolves on fresh Pastor but my conviction remains the same. The beautiful part is that it's not 'her Pastor's conviction' at this point... but her own valuable heartfelt conviction. The same kind of conviction that so many of us should have about so many things.

However, I'm not 'trapped' as you seem to imply because I understand the spirit of the law was greater than the law itself. I have found unique and valuable guidance in my perusal of this matter and am VERY comfortable that she had every right to salvage what 'glory' she had left.

For the record, the issue (as stated before) was taken care of today. It was breathtaking how God facilitated the solution in her life. I'm a very passionate preacher and very direct in my approach to teaching God's Word. I'm not, however, the kind to humiliate people nor do I take pleasure in embarrassing anybody.

However, this morning I was teaching a lesson in a series I put together called "Protecting Our Relationships". Basically, after an extended fast I began to studying some prophecy thinking that I may teach on the end times. When I listed all the scriptures that I retrieved the Lord pointed out a fact that amazed me: over 75% of everything spoken dealing with the end time had to do with relationships.

I taught several weeks on 'Protecting your Relationship with God' and for the last three weeks have taught on 'Protecting your Relationship with the Church'. I dealt with everything from critical Saints to racism and was ready to close... when suddenly the Spirit of the Lord rushed in with yet another wave of anointing. My heart began to pour out the need for us to be 'flexible' in our experience and that - even with our firm, fixed message - we need to be flexible enough to deal righteously with those things for which there is no 'easy' biblical answer.

God smote my heart and I immediately called this precious Sister up and explained her dilemma which had gone on for over 4 months. I spoke of how the same God that proclaimed the Sabbath should be 'kept holy' told them to 'remove the ox from the ditch - even on the Sabbath! Though not according to custom it WAS in line with 'keeping it holy'. What, under normal circumstances, would be forbidden became in that unique situation an act of holiness itself. Do we slam our fist down and scream, "Condemn them!" Absolutely not because the spirit of the law exceeded the law itself.

Before it was over this precious Sister was lost in the Spirit and the entire Church was on their feet weeping, talking in tongues and sincerely hugging each others' necks. God, in that one moment, built a fence around this precious Saint that salvaged her mind from condemnation and God gave us a first hand lesson on 'Protecting your Relationship with the Church' that most will never forget. It was simply overwhelming.

Ironically, there were many women that joined her this afternoon when she did cut the knot out. They delicately moved little by little retrieving as much of the hair as they could and there wasn't a dry eye in the room as this sister sat there speaking in tongues on and off for over 3 hours. What was thought would end up being practically 'shaved' ended up leaving about 8 inches... enough that she (of her own desire) found a perfect 'clip on' type hair piece and could fix it up.

When I left the Church tonight she was still dancing around the altar.

Enough said.

Originally Posted by Carpenter

Actually, I am astonished at the the difficulty in this situation. Maybe this means I don't have a true appreciation of corporate convictions. I just question the disconnect when convictions seem to transcend the Word of God.

It appears to me, considering the letter of the law (because as we know, the spirit of the law is to misinterpret scripture), then she should not cut her hair for any reason. Paul had HIS thorn and we all have a cross to bear...yada yada yada...

A pastor giving her the OK, smacks of moral relativism. How is it that a pastor with a stroke of a pen, can seem to contradict a cornerstone of his ministry?

Unfortunately this has put this poor dear in an untenable situation. Essentially, the preacher put her there, now he is doing his best to try and get her out? Is there no personal conviction?

This to me is kind of like straining at a gnat.

...and it probably wasn't helpful to anyone.

Carp.........






No. No need. It's really not worth the effort.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Steadfast

Carp.........






No. No need. It's really not worth the effort.

Whether or not I completely agree with someone on an issue, I respect that they have not only their conviction but that they have a right attitude pertaining to that conviction. And even more so when they recognize the spirit of the law vs the letter of the law.

It really would not be worth the effort to reply to Cooper..glad you didn't waste your time

[The Dean]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Whether or not I completely agree with someone on an issue, I respect that they have not only their conviction but that they have a right attitude pertaining to that conviction. And even more so when they recognize the spirit of the law vs the letter of the law.

It really would not be worth the effort to reply to Cooper..glad you didn't waste your time

I agree. No need to.

[Barb]

Originally Posted by whollyHis

Reading through this thread has given me a 'pause' in my thinking...when I first read the initial post, my reaction was "Duh, cut the knot out." But, then I had to re-examine my beliefism. If indeed, I believed that uncut hair was a salvation issue, why would I be so quick to condemn this dear lady to a sure eternity in hell?? For there is no room for sin in that city. There will be no sin stains there...As some have stated so well, before me, do we 'wink' at salvational issues because of convenience sake?

I have a lot to pray about concerning this issue, I see.

I fully understand what you mean, WH...

As one who has written much about this and considered myself an 'apologist' for the cause, I've had to grapple with much of this myself. I have much to pray about as well...

[Ferd]

Steadfast, I am sometimes amazed when I see God take some form of bad and turn it to such good. I dont know why because it happens more often than we really think.


I just wish more people here understood.

[StillStanding]

Steadfast, What a wonderful story about how the situation was handled!

[Falla39]

Originally Posted by Steadfast

To this we wholeheartedly agree.

The issue was 'resolved' today and how it came to a conclusion was absolutely supernatural. Perhaps I'll post more on it later.

Thank YOU, Dear Lord Jesus,

There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in

Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free

from the law of sin and death.

So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

One thing about it, when we get in the Spirit, and the Spirit

takes over, it will do the leading and give direction and then

there will be no condemnation.

I went to bed praying that God would "deliver" this dear lady as

He would see fit to do it! Appears He had already took care of it.

In my mind as I read Bro. Steadfast's account of the SISTERS in

the church gathering around this sister for three hours as she was

in the Spirit, reminded me of mid-wives assisted in a "delivery". It

may not have seemed to be a "baby" but just wait. It may have

just been the "delivery" of a "Revival Child". God knows!

Some through the water, some through the flood,
Some through the fire, but all through the blood.
Some through great trials, but God gives a song,
In the night seasons and all the day long!!
God leads His dear children along.

Prayer and fasting and God's Word brings about something

that nothing else can!!!

Incidentally, when I was younger, I remember one or two of

my sisters going to bed with gum in their mouths only to awake

with it in their hair. The end resulted in seperating what could

be, and clipping only the affected part.

May God give all of us, of His Wisdom and Understanding. His Word

tells us if we lack (need more) wisdom God giveth liberally but He

wants us to ask. Ask, seek, knock! He has plenty of whatever we

need!!!!

Blessings,

Falla39

[Carpenter]

Originally Posted by Steadfast

Carp.........






No. No need. It's really not worth the effort.

The ace I have in my boot is that you cannot tell whether I really believe what I wrote, you just didn't have the temerity to respond to that kind of charge...that could have come from anyone. That is the point.

Really though, I suppose if we create a scenario or cultural value that is vital to us and to our walk with God, the religious ceremony associated with manifesting it can be made as powerful as you need it to be in order to validate it.

[rrford]

Originally Posted by Carpenter

The ace I have in my boot is that you cannot tell whether I really believe what I wrote, you just didn't have the temerity to respond to that kind of charge...that could have come from anyone. That is the point.

Really though, I suppose if we create a scenario or cultural value that is vital to us and to our walk with God, the religious ceremony associated with manifesting it can be made as powerful as you need it to be in order to validate it.

What if the ceremony is necessary to the cultural value? And what if it is not necessarily created but scripturally mandated?