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09-03-2007, 12:16 PM
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Guest
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: H-Town, Texas
Posts: 18,009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stmatthew
Bro,
Your main OP church Orgs (UPC, ALJC, etc) do not accept triniatrians as saved. That is why I say the majority does not. Even the AWCF used to be anti Trinitarian. I am not sure what they are now.
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Why is it that the ALJC trumps the PAW when we discuss main Oneness orgs?
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09-03-2007, 12:17 PM
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Supercalifragilisticexpiali...
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 19,197
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea
If this is true ... then the views I've expressed are not in the minority ... or undermining?
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DA, I enjoy many of your posts and it is apparant you have strong feelings on some hotbutton issues in the UPC, but please, take this from a non-intellectual; there is a tone in many of your posts that is fatalistic in regards to the UPC, and in that sense you are seen as undermining by some on this forum.
__________________
"It is inhumane, in my opinion, to force people who have a genuine medical need for coffee to wait in line behind people who apparently view it as some kind of recreational activity." Dave Barry 2005
I am a firm believer in the Old Paths
Articles on such subjects as "The New Birth," will be accepted, whether they teach that the new birth takes place before baptism in water and Spirit, or that the new birth consists of baptism of water and Spirit. - THE PENTECOSTAL HERALD Dec. 1945
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves
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09-03-2007, 12:19 PM
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Guest
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: H-Town, Texas
Posts: 18,009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen Hoover
DA, I enjoy many of your posts and it is apparant you have strong feelings on some hotbutton issues in the UPC, but please, take this from a non-intellectual; there is a tone in many of your posts that is fatalistic in regards to the UPC, and in that sense you are seen as undermining by some on this forum.
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SH ..I take your opinion w/ high regard ... but nothing in this thread is an attack on the UPC but rather a discussion on doctrinal views that exist and are debated within all of Apostolicdom. I challenge anyone that can find an anti-UPC post in this thread authored by me.
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09-03-2007, 12:26 PM
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Smiles everyone...Smiles!!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Sparta, TN
Posts: 2,399
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea
Why is it that the ALJC trumps the PAW when we discuss main Oneness orgs?
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Dan,
I am not saying there are none moving towards the "trinitarians are saved" belief. I just do not believe it is as widespread as it was proposed to be.
As far as the PAW, yes, they are pushing that way, but they also have many of the congregation walking out of their conventions when they have trinitarians up preaching, so I would say they are in a "civil way" over this much like the UPCI is in regards to the tv issue.
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09-03-2007, 12:37 PM
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Supercalifragilisticexpiali...
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 19,197
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea
SH ..I take your opinion w/ high regard ... but nothing in this thread is an attack on the UPC but rather a discussion on doctrinal views that exist and are debated within all of Apostolicdom. I challenge anyone that can find an anti-UPC post in this thread authored by me.
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Not an attack, nor even anti-UPC posts. But a fatalistic tone that cannot possibly be construed as constructive criticism.
Carry on. I am not taking issue with you, just stating why I think you are not received by some here.
__________________
"It is inhumane, in my opinion, to force people who have a genuine medical need for coffee to wait in line behind people who apparently view it as some kind of recreational activity." Dave Barry 2005
I am a firm believer in the Old Paths
Articles on such subjects as "The New Birth," will be accepted, whether they teach that the new birth takes place before baptism in water and Spirit, or that the new birth consists of baptism of water and Spirit. - THE PENTECOSTAL HERALD Dec. 1945
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves
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09-03-2007, 12:42 PM
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Supercalifragilisticexpiali...
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 19,197
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stmatthew
I would be very surprised to find any great number within the UPC that would accept a trinitarian as saved. Even here in loosey-goosey liberal land TN most of them still believe that it takes Acts 2:38 to be saved. |
Matt, though French's research shows the majority of Oneness Pentecostals are not a part of the UPC, PAW, ALJC, even there you are hard pressed to find many constituents believing the terms "Assembly of God" and "Christian" are mutually exclusive.
__________________
"It is inhumane, in my opinion, to force people who have a genuine medical need for coffee to wait in line behind people who apparently view it as some kind of recreational activity." Dave Barry 2005
I am a firm believer in the Old Paths
Articles on such subjects as "The New Birth," will be accepted, whether they teach that the new birth takes place before baptism in water and Spirit, or that the new birth consists of baptism of water and Spirit. - THE PENTECOSTAL HERALD Dec. 1945
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves
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09-03-2007, 12:47 PM
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Smiles everyone...Smiles!!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Sparta, TN
Posts: 2,399
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen Hoover
Matt, though French's research shows the majority of Oneness Pentecostals are not a part of the UPC, PAW, ALJC, even there you are hard pressed to find many constituents believing the terms "Assembly of God" and "Christian" are mutually exclusive.
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I have lived in Bristol TN, Knoxville TN, and now Nashville TN (I guess Memphis is next  ). I have visited most churches that claimed to be OP in these cities and surrounding cities. I have yet to find one that believed a trinitarian was saved. It may indeed be there, but in my realm of visiting churches, I have not found it to be true.
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09-03-2007, 12:50 PM
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Smiles everyone...Smiles!!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Sparta, TN
Posts: 2,399
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stmatthew
I have lived in Bristol TN, Knoxville TN, and now Nashville TN (I guess Memphis is next ). I have visited most churches that claimed to be OP in these cities and surrounding cities. I have yet to find one that believed a trinitarian was saved. It may indeed be there, but in my realm of visiting churches, I have not found it to be true. |
I just have to throw this out there 
I wonder how many of those that have accepted trinitarians as saved have continued to hold holiness standards??
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09-03-2007, 01:42 PM
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Supercalifragilisticexpiali...
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 19,197
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stmatthew
I just have to throw this out there
I wonder how many of those that have accepted trinitarians as saved have continued to hold holiness standards?? |
Brother, in my world the vast majority of conservative "holiness standard" keepers accept Trinitarians as well as Oneness. In fact most are some form of Trinitarian themselves. They disagree to the point of separating but most do not judge the other into hell.
__________________
"It is inhumane, in my opinion, to force people who have a genuine medical need for coffee to wait in line behind people who apparently view it as some kind of recreational activity." Dave Barry 2005
I am a firm believer in the Old Paths
Articles on such subjects as "The New Birth," will be accepted, whether they teach that the new birth takes place before baptism in water and Spirit, or that the new birth consists of baptism of water and Spirit. - THE PENTECOSTAL HERALD Dec. 1945
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves
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09-03-2007, 01:55 PM
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Smiles everyone...Smiles!!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Sparta, TN
Posts: 2,399
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen Hoover
Brother, in my world the vast majority of conservative "holiness standard" keepers accept Trinitarians as well as Oneness. In fact most are some form of Trinitarian themselves. They disagree to the point of separating but most do not judge the other into hell.
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Bro Stephen,
I can honestly say that I have not been in contact to any degree with the circle you seem to know of. I know of a few independents here and there, but most of them embrace such off the wall doctrines such as even the devil being saved, that I would not claim them as OP.
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