Platform Standards

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

To King David messing with a mans beard was a great abomination! He went to war with several nations over such an incident.

2 Samuel 10:4-7

4 Wherefore Hanun took David’s servants, and shaved off the one half of their beards, and cut off their garments in the middle, even to their buttocks, and sent them away. 5 When they told it unto David, he sent to meet them, because the men were greatly ashamed: and the king said, Tarry at Jericho until your beards be grown, and then return.

6 And when the children of Ammon saw that they stank before David, the children of Ammon sent and hired the Syrians of Beth-rehob, and the Syrians of Zoba, twenty thousand footmen, and of king Maacah a thousand men, and of Ish-tob twelve thousand men. 7 And when David heard of it, he sent Joab, and all the host of the mighty men.

But todays preachers wont let such valiant and honorable men on their "platform".

Uh...that says ASHAMED not ABOMINATION.

[Sasha]

Originally Posted by Abiding Now

So you think pants on a woman is ok with God?

Do you think pants on a man is ok with God?

[Sasha]

Originally Posted by hometown guy

And I don't fellowship any churches that allow men to preach with beards but I have NEVER heard anyone say that a beard was sin and you can't name any respectable conservative that has said that either.

I can name one, but I won't.

[bishoph]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

To be clear HERE is the reason I say these Preachers are playing the hypocrite.

On one hand they take this scripture from the law of Moses:

5 The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman’s garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God. Duet. 22:5

And on that basis declare that women who do not wear dresses are going to Hell.

On the other hand THIS scripture also in the law of Moses states:

5 They shall not make baldness upon their head, neither shall they shave off the corner of their beard, nor make any cuttings in their flesh. Lev. 21:5

So they take Duet 22:5 and make it the most important verse in the Bible BUT YET they totally IGNORE the exhortation from Leviticus that commands NOT to shave their beards!

So IF a woman is condemned over Duet. 22:5 they certainly are over Leviticus 21:5.

To me this is hypocrisy. No doubt many thousands of sincere searchers for Oneness truth have been turned away some having to return to Trinitarianism, at least welcoming arms there, others probably back to the world after feeling the rejection of those who are supposed to be like Christ.

My good brother, I know your zeal for the Lord and your defense of the true doctrines of salvation, God, and others......I honor/respect that.

What I cannot understand is why so many people cannot see the "for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God" clause that is used here but NOT used in most of the other laws. I am not going to get into what defines a man's or woman's garment......but God did say that anyone who wears garments that are designed for/made for the opposite sex becomes an abomination to the Lord. There is a distinct difference between things that were commanded of the nation to hate/refrain from doing etc. and something God hates. National customs could change with time and a New Covenant, but something God hates would not be subject to change.

BTW.... I am NOT arguing that you HAVE to shave for ANY reason, most certainly not to be saved.

[hometown guy]

Originally Posted by Sasha

I can name one, but I won't.

Doubt it......

[hometown guy]

Originally Posted by bishoph

My good brother, I know your zeal for the Lord and your defense of the true doctrines of salvation, God, and others......I honor/respect that.

What I cannot understand is why so many people cannot see the "for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God" clause that is used here but NOT used in most of the other laws. I am not going to get into what defines a man's or woman's garment......but God did say that anyone who wears garments that are designed for/made for the opposite sex becomes an abomination to the Lord. There is a distinct difference between things that were commanded of the nation to hate/refrain from doing etc. and something God hates. National customs could change with time and a New Covenant, but something God hates would not be subject to change.

BTW.... I am NOT arguing that you HAVE to shave for ANY reason, most certainly not to be saved.

I touched on this and he didn't want to hear it but maybe yours will get through to him.

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by bishoph

Well......when all you beard wearing preachers start opening blind eyes, healing the lame and raising the dead (and I ain't talking about when they all wake up at the end of your sermon) then maybe you'll be invited to preach a few places.


(Just joking with ya.....a little.....lol)

Oh don't worry about me not being asked to preach in Apostolic Churches. I have found very little interest in truth among them once they have got Acts 2:38 and Duet. 22:5 down pat they think they have arrived!

Yes a little levity there but based in truth from my observations.

[Sasha]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

As a regular member of the "platform", I feel your pain. However, I understand the dynamic behind it, which stems largely from ministerial peer pressure. IMO, churches who have specific platform standards probably also have a pastor who doesn't feel those standards are heaven-or-hell issues. It's about getting along with neighboring pastors and not rocking the organizational boat.

That said, I think it's perfectly fine for the pastor to set up guidelines for people who are up front and representing the church as a whole. Things like, "wear business casual" or "be clean shaven" or "make sure your hair looks nice." Those aren't standards in anyone's book, really. It's about looking neat and presentable. I realize that the no beards thing is annoying to some men, but having a rule about being clean shaven is probably more about neatness than the pastor thinking it's a salvational issue.

Bottom line, I think it's a stretch to call other Christians hypocrites because they have a set of rules for staff or people who are the most visible. In fact, calling other Christians hypocrites might be worse than asking a man to shave.

And let's be honest...if anyone gets picked apart by 'the saints', it's the platform folks. Nobody ever says, "Did you see what that lady in the second row, third from left was wearing last night?"

No. They pick apart the choir and the praise singers and SS teachers.

[bishoph]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

But I am pointing out hypocrisy. If its not a sin to have a beard why do men forbid someone from ministering who does it? What gives them the right to go against what you apparently judge women into Hell over (the law of Moses)?

And lets get this straight. If a man comes into your Church with a full beard but he does not shave the edges off then you would welcome him in your "platform"?

Attitude and spirit go a long way with me. If a man exemplified the spirit of Christ would he demand that I accommodate him? Would it even be an issue if he had the right spirit and attitude? If he came into a church with a chip on his shoulder and wanted to make it an issue.......he needs to grow in his relationship with God more than he needs the liberty to minister in a church.

[Michael The Disciple]

Bishop said:

BTW.... I am NOT arguing that you HAVE to shave for ANY reason, most certainly not to be saved.

But you seem to be saying that somehow a beard makes a man less holy when IF ANYTHING according to the law of Moses it would make them MORE holy.

If it does not make a man less holy why should he not be able to preach at your Church?