Tithing…Is it a command?

[NotforSale]

Praise the Lord, Scott,

This book, The Tithe That Binds, is the result of of someone with real questions that deserve an honest answer. His response has posotive and negative outcome.

My first concern is, he has never been a pastor or pioneered a church from scratch. Not understanding the struggle involved with these challenges, it's very easy to draw vain conclusions regarding the tithe/offering/giving (whatever you want to call it), to get a work off the ground. For many years, the money taken in to start the work here was used to launch the church in our city. We took virtually no income from the church, my wife and I working full time to support our family's needs. After 10 years, we still both work full time. This may change, but if not, that's OK, too. "Whatever it takes!"

Only those who have done this, understand the pain. Preaching, teaching, praying, studying, crying, waiting, building; the stress is beyond words. Time in the day is never enough. Most men and women who labor for the Lord in the field of pioneering a church give thier all and use whatever comes in to help the work of the Lord to go forward. We gave, the saints gave, we all worked together. Everyone sacraficed.

This book caries the tone of a man with an "Axe to Grind". This is the common thread of those who despise the giving of money, even though they say they love to give: Bro Moore has shown in his writings a common denominator of those who struggle with this issue; He claims God's will by the measure of return in "things". This is an absolute warning of ill intent and the cancer of illusion that has plagued the Amercian church. This type of fleece leads to the utter despair of lies and contaminated theory.

When will we learn, God's blessings can come in the form of trials, testings, and the valley of hopelessness. God is a romantic, sweeping in to save his own at the last minute to prove once again, He is our strength, Deliverer, our ultimate Friend. When the disciples left all, Jesus didn't give them more "things" to prove His blessing. He gave them life, and life more abundant by opening thier eyes to the truth. "Things" were not in the equation.

Bro Moore also uses dreams to confirm his theology. This is very dangeroues. I have seen too many in the last 30 years use dreams to confirm, only to find the dreams were used to condemn the one who dreamed. Saying God gave you a dream must be done with caution and prayer.

I do agree with the book, we have seen very poor handling of money within the Church by those who use it for unessasary gain. But, this is not the benchmark to conclude how and what to give. The Bible is our benchmark. If we will draw close to the Lord with a hungry heart to serve Him in fullness, the air will clear and the bitterness will subside. We will see and understand, Jesus is asking for "ALL", not just 10%.

You'll throw the ruler away and with honesty you'll proclaim, "We have left all to follow, Him!" Until Christians come to this place, the bickering will continue. False religion will grow like a weed because money is the master and we the slave.

If you are in a church where you feel the money is being misused, move on, but don't allow yourself to become a Judas, hording the moneybag and twisting Scripture to relieve yourself from total surrender. I still believe this whole issue revolves around one simple fact; People love money.

[Neck]

Is it a commandment?

It is now, "Send me all of your tithe".

I will take it all.....

[Scott Hutchinson]

Originally Posted by bkstokes

No Scott,

Please give me a summary.

I haven't read it either myself.

[Scott Hutchinson]

My issue is not with giving because one should support the ministry they are getting fed the word from,and certainly should one give as they have been prospered to give,but the NT. I don't see a certain amount laid out to give.
God knows the heart and God knows our motive.

[Scott Hutchinson]

Now please understand I'm not here to hurt pastors because that is a office that God calls men to and a workman is worthy of his hire certainly.

This article has points I feel are worthy of consideration.
http://www.thewordoftruthministries.org/Tithes.htm

[Scott Hutchinson]

Originally Posted by NotforSale

Praise the Lord, Scott,

This book, The Tithe That Binds, is the result of of someone with real questions that deserve an honest answer. His response has posotive and negative outcome.

My first concern is, he has never been a pastor or pioneered a church from scratch. Not understanding the struggle involved with these challenges, it's very easy to draw vain conclusions regarding the tithe/offering/giving (whatever you want to call it), to get a work off the ground. For many years, the money taken in to start the work here was used to launch the church in our city. We took virtually no income from the church, my wife and I working full time to support our family's needs. After 10 years, we still both work full time. This may change, but if not, that's OK, too. "Whatever it takes!"

Only those who have done this, understand the pain. Preaching, teaching, praying, studying, crying, waiting, building; the stress is beyond words. Time in the day is never enough. Most men and women who labor for the Lord in the field of pioneering a church give thier all and use whatever comes in to help the work of the Lord to go forward. We gave, the saints gave, we all worked together. Everyone sacraficed.

This book caries the tone of a man with an "Axe to Grind". This is the common thread of those who despise the giving of money, even though they say they love to give: Bro Moore has shown in his writings a common denominator of those who struggle with this issue; He claims God's will by the measure of return in "things". This is an absolute warning of ill intent and the cancer of illusion that has plagued the Amercian church. This type of fleece leads to the utter despair of lies and contaminated theory.

When will we learn, God's blessings can come in the form of trials, testings, and the valley of hopelessness. God is a romantic, sweeping in to save his own at the last minute to prove once again, He is our strength, Deliverer, our ultimate Friend. When the disciples left all, Jesus didn't give them more "things" to prove His blessing. He gave them life, and life more abundant by opening thier eyes to the truth. "Things" were not in the equation.

Bro Moore also uses dreams to confirm his theology. This is very dangeroues. I have seen too many in the last 30 years use dreams to confirm, only to find the dreams were used to condemn the one who dreamed. Saying God gave you a dream must be done with caution and prayer.

I do agree with the book, we have seen very poor handling of money within the Church by those who use it for unessasary gain. But, this is not the benchmark to conclude how and what to give. The Bible is our benchmark. If we will draw close to the Lord with a hungry heart to serve Him in fullness, the air will clear and the bitterness will subside. We will see and understand, Jesus is asking for "ALL", not just 10%.

You'll throw the ruler away and with honesty you'll proclaim, "We have left all to follow, Him!" Until Christians come to this place, the bickering will continue. False religion will grow like a weed because money is the master and we the slave.

If you are in a church where you feel the money is being misused, move on, but don't allow yourself to become a Judas, hording the moneybag and twisting Scripture to relieve yourself from total surrender. I still believe this whole issue revolves around one simple fact; People love money.

Brother I appreciate your kind attitude and your honesty.

[Neck]

If ministers would preach tithing that is one thing.

It is this sowing and God's economy thing that is......

How many stories in the bible can be turned into sermons about giving money?

Someone even preached the David and Goliath story as a way of getting out of debt....

Since when did we turn taking up the offering the main part of the service?

We went from music, offering, to sermon and hopefully alter call.

To Music (More of a concert..Not a praise service) to offering, to sermon on sowing and giving, to alter call about how Jesus wants to heal you and make you rich......

The church theme song should be the Trump song.

Money, money money...money!

I literally fell like selling everything I have...

Leave myself with a pair of tub socks, some Michael Jordan briefs, a white T-Shirt and a toothpick.

You still have to look cool after everything is gone.

Remember if you gave everything you had to God.

Then if someone gave you $20.00 it would be 100 fold to what you currently have.

Maybe that is what some are after and mean by God giving me 100 Fold.

Alright all you pastor's...

Who wants my $650,000.00 after I sell it all?

But I want a written guarantee since your principal is a fact in scripture.

Jesus came that we may have life and money more abundantly....

I will give you 18 months for the good Lord to return my $650,000.00 into 100 times the sowing...

See even Steve Munsey finishes it off with we do not know what our heavenly reward will be worth.

In knowing that we are helping the lost....

My question is? I do not think they understand who the "lost" really are?.

[NotforSale]

I was speaking with my son last night. The issue of giving stirred me to share with him the hidden manna that God bestows upon us, leaving the shallow in heart unsatisfied. In my previous post I stated God's blessings can come very disguised. I think it's important to understand this so we may express our intent on giving properly. In other words, not give to get gain, but give so God may move on us as He desires.

I asked my son, in the story of Lazurus and the rich man, who was really blessed?

Lazurus was a begger with sores, which the dogs licked. He ate crumbs for a meal, was probably very unsightly to look at, had a reputation of being rejected and was most likely a man we would look at with disgust.

On the other hand, the rich man fared sumptously every day, wore fine clothes, and lived in ease in a nice house (American dream).

The American church has clearly painted the picture of the "Rich Man" blessing. More is the result of being blessed. Less is the result of being damned (having sinned). This may not be what is actually said, but it is the hidden message.

In the end, who was blessed? Who was in the will of God?

Until we understand this, our slide will be downward. God will be the bank instead of the Creator. We will hold back what belongs to Him. This vapor of time will strangle us with, "Mine, it's all mine!" We will choose well watered plains instead of the wilderness, pitching our tent towards cities of death. We will fight over tithes, offerings, and things because this is where the blessing is. Our scales will be corrupt. Our temples will become den's of thieves. A false balance will be our way.

A few years ago when we were on the verge of bankruptcy, I laid upon the floor of my office begging God for comfort. Church problems, financial problems, mid-life changes, all this brought me to my knees. I had started an Insurance business in total faith, hoping to secure some kind of income for my wife and I. Our bank account ran dry and things looked very bleak. We were in trouble; or were we???

Looking back, I realize God did a work in me in that moment of despair which gave me eternal focus and determination. Even if all is lost, God is all that matters; I understood this in a powerful, new way. This was not the only time where the Lord corrected my way of thinking. Doing the Lord's work has been a selling out experience ever since I obeyed His command to "GO". I have experienced joy from the dungeon and have learned to sing at midnight. This will carry me to the end of this life if I'll hold dear to my heart the priceless wisdom of freefall faith; all or nothing.

I learned a great deal in Marine Corps boot camp. In this training, it was all or nothing. You gave a 110%. You sold out to the USMC. The result was total transformation. When I became a Christian in the Military, I carried this thinking into my walk with God. The World knows. They know how to make the best. Marines being the elite fighting force on Planet earth comes with a price; EVERYTHING! Underneath the pain of training, discipline, and the forsaking of a past life was the hidden blessing of real change, something recruits don't think much about.

His hidden blessings are the best. I hope I will never barter away this understanding for the counterfiet idea, more means right. If we fien from this thinking, we will fall into His arms as a little child with total confidence. This change of heart will lead us to, "Father, what is mine is Yours. Nothing will separate me from knowing You. Not the kingdoms of this world, not a job, not a church which has faltered away from You. My realationship with You has no restraint. I love you Lord, with my ALL!"

God Bless!

[gloryseeker]

Originally Posted by Neck

If ministers would preach tithing that is one thing.

It is this sowing and God's economy thing that is......

How many stories in the bible can be turned into sermons about giving money?

Someone even preached the David and Goliath story as a way of getting out of debt....

Since when did we turn taking up the offering the main part of the service?

We went from music, offering, to sermon and hopefully alter call.

To Music (More of a concert..Not a praise service) to offering, to sermon on sowing and giving, to alter call about how Jesus wants to heal you and make you rich......

The church theme song should be the Trump song.

Money, money money...money!

I literally fell like selling everything I have...

Leave myself with a pair of tub socks, some Michael Jordan briefs, a white T-Shirt and a toothpick.

You still have to look cool after everything is gone.

Remember if you gave everything you had to God.

Then if someone gave you $20.00 it would be 100 fold to what you currently have.

Maybe that is what some are after and mean by God giving me 100 Fold.

Alright all you pastor's...

Who wants my $650,000.00 after I sell it all?

But I want a written guarantee since your principal is a fact in scripture.

Jesus came that we may have life and money more abundantly....

I will give you 18 months for the good Lord to return my $650,000.00 into 100 times the sowing...

See even Steve Munsey finishes it off with we do not know what our heavenly reward will be worth.

In knowing that we are helping the lost....

My question is? I do not think they understand who the "lost" really are?.

My suggestion would be that you get into a GOOD Bible study

[ultrajet]

Some may agree, some may deny, but just check anyway.
It's a worth read

http://www.takehisheart.com/givingti...bletithing.htm