Understanding Holiness - Page 10

shawndell · #91 03-19-2009, 09:06 AM

The first standard of holyness is love because that is what God is and we are to be his image.If we follow the love rule that God made then everything else like the ten commandments and the friut of the spirit and recieving the holyghost and all that God expects is fullfilled. As far as the outward man you can dress in so called holyness and not be full of Gods love then we are no better than the scribes and pharesies that Jesus was always upset with remember how they always wanted to condem and was full of contempt for thier fellow man ?

shawndell · #92 03-19-2009, 09:10 AM

However I parsonely believe that we are to present our bodies as a living sacrifice before the lord and be moddest.That doesnt mean we are to judge another because God only knows the heart of all man.

*AQuietPlace* · #93 03-19-2009, 09:17 AM

"By this shall all men know that you are my disciples......"

CC1 · #94 03-19-2009, 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shawndell

However I parsonely believe that we are to present our bodies as a living sacrifice before the lord and be moddest.That doesnt mean we are to judge another because God only knows the heart of all man.

Don't forget that "modesty" is a moving target to some degree depending on the society, culture, and age one lives in.

Pentecostal women of today would be considered extemely immodest for showing their ankles by non Pentecostals in the Victorian age.

However we can all agree on some basics like baring ones breasts, wearing bikini's to Wal Mart, etc, etc. A lot of common sense things that don't require a laundry list of do's and don'ts.

Old time Pentecostals always seem to use as an excuse that "you have to have some standards!" , which is of course obvious. Everybody has standards in their life for many different things. A standard of work ethic, morality, etc.

Where OTP's get off track is trying to take the concept to legalism by dictating to extreme details a huge list of do's and don'ts that are not Biblical but the supposed application of Biblical principle based on a man's personal interpretation of such. No room left for common sense, guiding of the Holy Spirit, decisions based on prayer and the study of God's word, etc, etc.

*AQuietPlace* · #95 03-19-2009, 09:35 AM

I was rather surprised to discover recently that the word 'modest' is in the Bible only one time. And, in my opinion, in that instance it is not even referring to the amount of skin covered, but rather means 'moderate'. I think it ties in with the costly array concept.

I think that "modesty" in the way we mean it, is covered by 'loving your neighbor'. We dress in a "modest" (amount of skin covered) way out of consideration to those around us.

Honestly, much clothing (or lack thereof) is just way Too Much Information!!

shawndell · #96 03-19-2009, 09:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CC1

Don't forget that "modesty" is a moving target to some degree depending on the society, culture, and age one lives in.

Pentecostal women of today would be considered extemely immodest for showing their ankles by non Pentecostals in the Victorian age.

However we can all agree on some basics like baring ones breasts, wearing bikini's to Wal Mart, etc, etc. A lot of common sense things that don't require a laundry list of do's and don'ts.

Old time Pentecostals always seem to use as an excuse that "you have to have some standards!" , which is of course obvious. Everybody has standards in their life for many different things. A standard of work ethic, morality, etc.

Where OTP's get off track is trying to take the concept to legalism by dictating to extreme details a huge list of do's and don'ts that are not Biblical but the supposed application of Biblical principle based on a man's personal interpretation of such. No room left for common sense, guiding of the Holy Spirit, decisions based on prayer and the study of God's word, etc, etc.

I agree with you about modesty being a moving target that seem to change with the times however I believe what ever work you do for Jesus that work is between us and him and when we keep our eyes in love on him he will lead us and we will be safe in the knowledge of his love.

*AQuietPlace* · #97 03-19-2009, 09:59 AM

Something else I find interesting..... almost any time a preacher says "We still believe in holiness around here!!", he is referring to dress standards. I've personally never heard that said when he wasn't referring to dress standards.

And yet... I don't believe that's what the Bible is talking about when it refers to holiness.

A church can be a strong HOLINESS church, and be full of gossip, envy, dishonesty, even adultery and worse. And there are some 'holiness' people who have no relationship with God whatsoever.

I'd love to see us get back to focusing on true holiness.

CC1 · #98 03-19-2009, 10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by *AQuietPlace*

Something else I find interesting..... almost any time a preacher says "We still believe in holiness around here!!", he is referring to dress standards. I've personally never heard that said when he wasn't referring to dress standards.

This has been my many decades of experience also but UPC / Old Time Pentecostals on here will deny it to the end.

I think the problem is that in an intellecual discussion they don't equate standards with holiness but the reality is that they do in practice.

Theophil · #99 03-19-2009, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by *AQuietPlace*

Something else I find interesting..... almost any time a preacher says "We still believe in holiness around here!!", he is referring to dress standards. I've personally never heard that said when he wasn't referring to dress standards.

And yet... I don't believe that's what the Bible is talking about when it refers to holiness.

A church can be a strong HOLINESS church, and be full of gossip, envy, dishonesty, even adultery and worse. And there are some 'holiness' people who have no relationship with God whatsoever.

I'd love to see us get back to focusing on true holiness.

Ephesians 4:24-25 (KJV)
24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness. 25 Wherefore putting away lying, speak every man truth with his neighbour: for we are members one of another. . .

According to Apostle Paul, in Eph. 4 & 5, true holiness is concerned with 3 major areas...1. Honesty 2. Peace in relationships 3. Sexual Purity

coadie · #**100** 03-19-2009, 01:05 PM

HIS HOLINESS THE DALAI LAMA
The Dalai Lama, Tenzin Gyatso, is the spiritual and temporal Leader of the Tibetan people. He was born on July 6, 1935, in a small village called Taktser, in north eastern Tibet. Born to a peasant family, His Holiness was recognised at the age of two, in accordance with Tibetan tradition, as the reincarnation of his predecessor the 13th Dalai Lama.

The Dalai Lamas are the manifestations of the Buddha of Compassion who chose to take rebirth for the Blah blah blah.

Last time i checked, two year olds manifested a spirit and it was not holiness.

Ephesians 4:24-25 (KJV)
24 And that ye put on the new man,

I realize holiness is an extensive topic. I also see the worldliness movements try to narrow down holiness to certain items regarding appearance and really mask the fact that they have not and don't intend to become a new person. They have not be washed in re generation and put on a new man and are generous in labeling those that have as being legalistic.

Holiness is separation from the world. Christianity and salvation separates the new man from the old man. It is not the old man and merely some new vocabulary.

To be carnally minded is to be at enmity with God.
There are still many holiness churches around and many have revival as we speak. I see within those churches, there are a few people holiness in name only. If they leave, they say the church was not holiness but they were really speaking for themselves.