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  #91  
Old 03-19-2007, 09:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Just a Shepherd View Post
It is being sent out free to the ministerial fellowship. It is eight dollars for additional copies and that is not unreasonable considering shipping costs are included. When publishing a small quantity of books the printing costs are much higher than with bestsellers. For you that's about two cups of your socialite coffee indulgences. Not a bad trade off if you ask me.

That is good to hear that they are sending it out free to the ministry. They are probably just hoping for the sales to other interested parties help cover the overall costs of producing it.

You must not read my posts very closely. I am a cheapskate!!!! I just can't bring myself to buy those expensive cups of fancy coffees. At least not for myself. I get them for my wife when she wants them or when on business trips business associates do and it will be on my expense account. Other than that I am looking for the free or very cheap plain ole coffee!!!
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  #92  
Old 03-19-2007, 09:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Just a Shepherd View Post
To order the book:

Mail $8.00 (includes s/h) to:

Peter F. Connell
112 Heritage Ct.
Oakley, CA 94561

Make checks payable to:
Cornerstone Pentecostal Church
Thank you...

What I would like to see is a document from two representative parties put together by the UPC for everyone to examine both sides of the issue. Not just assertions but facts and studies etc etc
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  #93  
Old 03-25-2007, 03:54 PM
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Bump for lady rev
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  #94  
Old 03-25-2007, 05:00 PM
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I am a cheapskate!!!! I
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  #95  
Old 03-25-2007, 10:14 PM
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Are they going to kick out all the ministers that vote for it, and the ones that wrote the book? After all they signed a statement that they agreed with the manual as it is currently written. And evidently they lied... my Bible teaches me that all liers will have their place in the lake of fire.
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  #96  
Old 03-25-2007, 10:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Just a Shepherd View Post
It is being sent out free to the ministerial fellowship. It is eight dollars for additional copies and that is not unreasonable considering shipping costs are included. When publishing a small quantity of books the printing costs are much higher than with bestsellers. For you that's about two cups of your socialite coffee indulgences. Not a bad trade off if you ask me.
I hate it when I am thrust into making tough decisions!


However, being a man of honor I will do what I must - I'll go with the two coffee indulgences.
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  #97  
Old 04-09-2007, 09:15 AM
Puzzled Puzzled is offline
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I've read the book twice. Why? Because I wanted to do it the 2nd time w/a highlighter and make notes.

The book can be roughly summarized (in my opinion) as:

We've long stood against TV and it's evils.

TV has negative effects on youth who watch violence and are dumbed down by constant base immersion into it's environment.

Radio, Cell Phones, Internet are also great tools for Satan... but we need all those things... so we simply control them. Well... we haven't controlled cell phones but we've done a good job of controlling cell phones (yes... it's just that contradictory in one place).

We need to go back to simply preaching everywhere... and I mean everywhere... mall parking lots, Wal-marts, standing in line at the DMV, in McDonalds... everywhere... just like the parable of the sower who indiscriminately spread his seed on both dry, shallow and stony ground. We need to preach everywhere... well... everywhere except the TV that is. Umm... yeah, that does sound strange doesn't it?

There are a couple of slippery slope arguments about how if you allow television... it's just going to be a catalyst/stepping stone for tearing down all known "holiness" standards. And we all know the illogical implications of such arguments.

It's chock full of anecdotal stories of how Dick and Jane used TV for ministry and their church dried up and lost the power of God. Wow... so if we find positive results then what?

There's some statistics on the ineffectiveness of TV ministries but you can find statistics for anything. I'm not discrediting this argument actually. Barna is pretty objective in his stats, but they are dated. In addition, I don't think that TV is the end all/be all solution for end time revival. Yet it is a tool. And it's no more inherently evil than the internet, radio, etc. It's simply a technological medium. It can be used for good or bad. Period. Are you managing it... or are you avoiding it? Without contact... you can make no impact.


End summary...


I was very disappointed in the book. I would like to hear some more logical and objective arguments against TV and not as much anecdotal stuff and shallow arguments which don't hold up to real scrutiny.

If we have yielded to all the other forms of technology for the most part with the caveat understanding that they must be moderated, filtered, etc, then why continue to isolate TV (television) as being more "evil." The argument against tv and for the internet turns into a more pragmatic argument than a moral one. "Well... yeah the internet is bad... but it's got much information on it... and we need it. So we have to manage it." Well if that's what's causing us to accept the internet over TV then the argument loses all it's moral punch.


In addition... I think we've done a great injustice as a whole in highlighting particulars where the Bible has given us principals. We've said: "TV's are bad" instead of "much of television programming is unwholesome and should be avoided and managed by viewing positive or educational programming and family channels."

The gospel must be preached in every culture, age, country and to every people. The current Articles of Faith will not fit in every culture, age, country and every people. The scriptures do. Why? Because the Bible has particular methods for salvation and it has moral principals that fit every age, culture and people. We've majored in the minors so to speak on so many issues. While ignoring other issues.

God help us,

Troy
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  #98  
Old 04-12-2007, 09:16 PM
HappyPastor2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCaliUPC View Post
I agree. I would, however, like something to go out to the ministers that had something pro and against....much as I would like to see forums of such on this topic be equal pro and against.

Based on the authors of the book...you know the slant is one of AGAINST. The same would be said if Anthony Mangun put out a book and you know the slant would be FOR. Now, I would like to see one put out to the membership that was written by WILSON or BOOKER and MANGUN. At least one would have an argument on both sides.
The May/June Issue of the Forward Magazine (Sent to all UPCI Ministers) will be dedicated to the issue with articles "for and against." There will also be a questionairre on the subject for each UPCI minister to send back - the results of which will be reported on in a future issue of the Forward and at the Tampa General Conference.

Regarding the book: The men who wrote this book did what they felt they must do to present their side. Certainly you would not want that censored. Open discussion on the issues - rather than emotional rhetoric - is needed. The book in question deals with ISSUES and presents a great many objective facts from third parties such as the Gallup Organization, Neilsen, Barna Research and others. I know a minister that told me he ought to write a response. I asked him if he read it yet (he has a copy) - and he told me "no." He was considering a response BEFORE even reading it. Typical.
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