Nuclear Iran

[Praxeas]

I have concluded that after a decade of warnings of Iran and it's nuclear ambitions that governments in the west WANTED Iran to develop the capability.

Yes one man on capital hill can be a total idiot, but all of them? No. Same goes for Europe. They whined about it. They cried "sanctions" that did nothing.

And what did WE do? We invaded Iraq and found nothing.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

I have concluded that after a decade of warnings of Iran and it's nuclear ambitions that governments in the west WANTED Iran to develop the capability.

Yes one man on capital hill can be a total idiot, but all of them? No. Same goes for Europe. They whined about it. They cried "sanctions" that did nothing.

And what did WE do? We invaded Iraq and found nothing.

If we stablize Iraq and it becomes a friendly nation we have a base of operations right next door to Iran. Doubt Iran would nuke their next door neighbor. We can conduct covert and overt military operations from Iraq... if it's a stablized friend of the United States.

Could this have been a reason why the Bush Administration played so dirty to justify a war with Iraq? Just thinking....

[Dedicated Mind]

Originally Posted by Aquila

If we stablize Iraq and it becomes a friendly nation we have a base of operations right next door to Iran. Doubt Iran would nuke their next door neighbor. We can conduct covert and overt military operations from Iraq... if it's a stablized friend of the United States.

Could this have been a reason why the Bush Administration played so dirty to justify a war with Iraq? Just thinking....

a stable Iraq is shiite majority would be an ally of Iran. I doubt the US will be performing military operations against Iran from a shiite Iraq.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Dedicated Mind

a stable Iraq is shiite majority would be an ally of Iran. I doubt the US will be performing military operations against Iran from a shiite Iraq.

What if our goal isn't a Shiite Iraq?

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Aquila

If we stablize Iraq and it becomes a friendly nation we have a base of operations right next door to Iran. Doubt Iran would nuke their next door neighbor. We can conduct covert and overt military operations from Iraq... if it's a stablized friend of the United States.

Could this have been a reason why the Bush Administration played so dirty to justify a war with Iraq? Just thinking....

if if if....Iraq stablized? It was stable before we invaded. Friendly? We we could have been friendly, but that is a long long story lol.

Saudi Arabia, we have a base there and that is pretty close. And why do we need a base of operations when we have a flotilla regularly stationed in the gulf?

Fears of Iran nuking Iraq are not what anyone is concerned about.

It's too late to conduct any sort of operations. The time to have done it was a LONG LONG time ago

No, it should have played dirty to justify a war with Iran.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Aquila

What if our goal isn't a Shiite Iraq?

Our goal? Our goal is to set up a stable government and RUN. BTW the previous government we ran down, was a Sunni ran government. And IF it appears we are trying to set up again a Sunni ran government, you can be sure there really will be no end to the insurgency...most of which is Shiite now.

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

I have concluded that after a decade of warnings of Iran and it's nuclear ambitions that governments in the west WANTED Iran to develop the capability.

Yes one man on capital hill can be a total idiot, but all of them? No. Same goes for Europe. They whined about it. They cried "sanctions" that did nothing.

And what did WE do? We invaded Iraq and found nothing.

Visit the East Coast now. Go see the Statue of Libert, visit the monuments, museums and memorials in Washington.

If you ever wanted to see Tel Aviv and the coast of Israel, get there now.

[n david]

Originally Posted by Aquila

If we stablize Iraq and it becomes a friendly nation we have a base of operations right next door to Iran. Doubt Iran would nuke their next door neighbor. We can conduct covert and overt military operations from Iraq... if it's a stablized friend of the United States.

Could this have been a reason why the Bush Administration played so dirty to justify a war with Iraq? Just thinking....

Let's not forget, it wasn't W or his administration that first talked of war against Iraq, nor was he or his administration the first to talk about WMD's.

Need we revisit the pages of quotes available from the Clinton years and from Democrats who demanded action before the second Iraq War began? I'm sick of hearing this absolute garbage about W's admin "playing so dirty" or lying about WMDs, etc.

The intelligence he - along with Clinton and several Democratic and Republican Congressmen - relied on was terrible.

W's not to blame for the intelligence, nor for the lack of WMDs, nor for playing dirty as you say.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

if if if....Iraq stablized? It was stable before we invaded. Friendly? We we could have been friendly, but that is a long long story lol.

Saudi Arabia, we have a base there and that is pretty close. And why do we need a base of operations when we have a flotilla regularly stationed in the gulf?

Fears of Iran nuking Iraq are not what anyone is concerned about.

It's too late to conduct any sort of operations. The time to have done it was a LONG LONG time ago

No, it should have played dirty to justify a war with Iran.

All good points. I was trying to remain positive. lol

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by n david

Let's not forget, it wasn't W or his administration that first talked of war against Iraq, nor was he or his administration the first to talk about WMD's.

Need we revisit the pages of quotes available from the Clinton years and from Democrats who demanded action before the second Iraq War began? I'm sick of hearing this absolute garbage about W's admin "playing so dirty" or lying about WMDs, etc.

The intelligence he - along with Clinton and several Democratic and Republican Congressmen - relied on was terrible.

W's not to blame for the intelligence, nor for the lack of WMDs, nor for playing dirty as you say.

Actually most of this dates back to the first Bush administration when Wolfowitz and then Secretary of Defense Dick Cheney drafted a paper illustrating the necessity of removing Saddam. A mass media campaign designed to shift public opinion in favor of the war was also discussed. It was then reviewed and opposed by then General Joint Cheif of Staff Colin Powell. Then the document was revised to merely express our position as a denunciation of Saddam's regime. It's actually a very interesting chain of events. The Iraq War was something that was being prepared back under Present Herbert Walker Bush. In fact he wanted to press forward and get the job done then, but backed off for political reasons.

And it is true that the Clinton Administration also supported regime change. However, they took a softer approach to Iraq and so actual regime change was put on the back burner. Interestingly enough, most of the Homeland Security strategies we have come to use were discussed at length under the Clinton Administration after the Oklahoma City bombing. Of course after 911 these strategies were beefed up a bit. For example Clinton favored wire tapping (which he now denies) and a national security agency focused on the homeland. But at the time civil liberties groups cried out against the Clinton Administration's positions and the process was again...back burnered.

It seems they (both Republicans and Democrats) do NOTHING until they absolutely have to.

As far as WMD intel being terrible... I thin the CIA is being a scapegoat on this one. Too many agents decried the information the Bush Administration presented. Some even quietly stepped down because of it. I believe the Bush Administration was engaging in a "Northwoods" type misinformation strategy in the environment that that 9/11 provided.

I understand that sometimes the government needs to lie to us and misinform us to protect us. My question is, was it justified or necessary?