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  #781  
Old 02-22-2008, 10:55 PM
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ChristopherHall ChristopherHall is offline
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Re: Why shouldn't I vote for Obama??

Ann Coulter? LOL
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  #782  
Old 02-22-2008, 11:31 PM
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ChristopherHall ChristopherHall is offline
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Re: Why shouldn't I vote for Obama??

Quote:
Originally Posted by OP_Carl View Post
IMPORTANT NEWS BULLETIN FOR CHRISTOPHER HALL:

McCain is NOT a conservative. He is only somewhat conservative. And the conservative media have been ripping him to shreds for MONTHS!!!!!!



The teacher's union is the single most dangerous entity that threatens the future of our country. That is my opinion. Your anecdotal evidence does not erase the FACT that spending on public schools has increased exponentially, and grades, test scores, and graduation rates have plummeted. Something is seriously wrong with this entity; it is not producing the results for which it exists.

In any other arena of life, this would be just cause for a massive overhaul if not outright eradication. Nevertheless, when it is pointed out that spending MORE money every year has not solved anything, nothing said subsequently is ever heard over the ensuing squawking about "the children."

Do you have any concept of the reaction that would occur if it were announced that public schooling had been declared unworkable, and all funding is to be cancelled, all real property auctioned off, and all systems privatized? Even though the present government system cannot answer or solve ANY of the problems, panel after panel of study concludes that they just need MORE MONEY. Chris you are a guy who frequently questions the status quo . . . how about this one?
Well, I personally don't think throwing more money at the system is going to resolve anything. First, the officials of the public schools always take a significant portion of it for themselves and their pet projects. The funds rarely get down to the schools that need them the most. Before putting any more money into the system I'd reform how the money is distributed to schools so it doesn't end up in some pockets of the local school board in systems that don't properly distribute funds.

I firmly believe that the problem with the public schools isn't that they are public (that's a cheap conservative whiny way out in my opinion). The problem isn't that they need more money (that's a worthless liberal non-answer to the problem). The problem is...the parents and the gasping death of the family. Families are falling apart. Postmodern people don't have the value system that was once instilled by parents into their children so infidelity and divorce are rampant. Financial pressures with the rising cost of living unmatched with an increase in wages means that families are actually making less to survive on. Families are folding under economic pressure everyday. Most of these parents come from broken homes and therefore they don't even know how it should be done. In order to make ends meet BOTH parents are working longer hours and hoping kids can raise themselves. Studies show American families are spending far more time working just to make ends meet than previous generations.

Kids are in this on their own. Without the guidance, love, and discipline they need it's obvious they aren't going to do well in school. The very notion that a teacher who sees them for roughly an hour a day can discipline them and educate them at the same time is laughable. Teachers are made scape goats by conservatives and their hands are tied by liberals. It's a mess but the answer is the same....the blame is on the parents. Parents who involve themselves in their child's education and are well enough to do for one of them to stay home and PARENT seem to have more success with their kids. I had a kid in Sunday School who's parents worked. He got out of school at 3:30 and his mom didn't get home until 5:30 or 6:00. Dad worked second shift and might as well be gone. This kid was messed up because he had successfully gotten involved in the wrong crowds while parents were away.

Parents have been reduced to corporate wage slaves and in their constant quest to pay the bills...they're loosing an entire generation.

Lack of values, lack of example, lack of time, financial pressures, it all adds up and crushes the life out of the family and the teachers inherit the monsters that this system is creating. I feel downright sorry for the public school teachers.

No relief in sight. The family is doomed unless we can find them some relief.

It's easy to say CLOSE THE SCHOOLS. But what happens next? This is the biggest beef I have with all this right wing pseudo-intellectualism. What next? I know it's bad...but let's assume we close the schools, auctioned off all the property, and privatized the system. Great, you just handed the little devils over to the private system that was somewhat good. Now it's full of the same kids that drove the public schools into ruin. The private schools will become just as bad. Why? Because the problem is PARENTS not parenting. This is the ol' conservative myth that the private market will redeem the soul and society. Baloney. Until we relieve families and equip parents with the tools they need these kids are lost. Public or Private, it doesn't matter.

So with that we ruin the private school system. Oh...and then there's the overwhelming reality that most parents of kids in public schools can't afford a private school. So the government is paying for all kids to go to private schools...WAY MORE EXPENSIVE THAN THE PUBLIC SYSTEM.

And then there is the issue of private schools deciding to kick kids into the streets to save their classrooms from the little hellions. So now we have a growing number of kids on the streets. Suddenly there's a boom in poverty, drug abuse, gang violence, robbery, the whole enchilada.

The only thing we can do is try to reform how funds are distributed to the public schools to target those schools that are truly in need. Thank God we at least have four walls to keep so many of these kids who don't know what a parent really is off the streets.

We need to find a way to help families be families again. The wage slave system isn't working. The consumerism isn't working. The Postmodern godlessness isn't working.

Those are my rambling thoughts.

God bless.
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  #783  
Old 02-23-2008, 08:23 AM
OP_Carl OP_Carl is offline
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Re: Why shouldn't I vote for Obama??

I agree with you that there is a crisis of parenting. That is why I am planning to take over the world, one well-behaved child at a time! Muwahahahahahahaha!

The issue is that there are no market pressures brought to bear on those responsible for the product, education. A teacher that cares and tries is rewarded no differently than one who barely goes through the motions, or one that abuses our trust by wasting class time to pontificate about his personal views in an attempt to indoctrinate. Normal, concerned parents aren't as involved because they know there is little recourse for them.

Think about it: If your kid comes home from summer camp and has specific gripes about that camp, next year you will shop for a different camp. But if your kid comes home from school and gripes about it, well, you had your complaints about school when you were a kid, and you don't have any options so you set about to condition the kid to adjust himself to the miserable circumstances.
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  #784  
Old 02-23-2008, 08:33 AM
OP_Carl OP_Carl is offline
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Re: Why shouldn't I vote for Obama??

To make it relevant, what has Obama accomplished in the area of improving education?

What are Obama's specific plans to improve education?

The only thing that sticks out in my mind at the moment about Hillary was a bill she helped put together around '92 or '93 that, among other things, sneaked in a provision that outlawed homeschooling and prohibited people from storing more than 3 months worth of food in their homes. Obviously folks didn't want her kind of help back then, and the bill never made it.

We homeschoolers are truly a thorn in the side of the NEA crowd. We are getting results that they can only dream of. I find it tragically shortsighted that their answer to this disparity is not to study our methods, but to attempt to stamp us out in the name of equality of outcome.
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Engineering solutions for theological problems.

Despite today's rising cost of living, it remains popular.

"It has been said that democracy is the worst form of government except all the others that have been tried." - Sir Winston Churchill

"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter." - Sir Winston Churchill

"They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security." - Benjamin Franklin
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  #785  
Old 02-23-2008, 01:19 PM
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Praxeas Praxeas is offline
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Re: Why shouldn't I vote for Obama??

Doesn't Obama sound like a southern name?
Alabama Obama?
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  #786  
Old 02-23-2008, 02:25 PM
OP_Carl OP_Carl is offline
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Re: Why shouldn't I vote for Obama??

It actually sounds more Western to me than Southern . . . . as in . . . . West Africa. You goober.
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Engineering solutions for theological problems.

Despite today's rising cost of living, it remains popular.

"It has been said that democracy is the worst form of government except all the others that have been tried." - Sir Winston Churchill

"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter." - Sir Winston Churchill

"They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security." - Benjamin Franklin
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  #787  
Old 02-23-2008, 04:07 PM
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Praxeas Praxeas is offline
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Re: Why shouldn't I vote for Obama??

Quote:
Originally Posted by OP_Carl View Post
It actually sounds more Western to me than Southern . . . . as in . . . . West Africa. You goober.
Al Uh Bam Uh...Oh Bam Uh...

Maybe Alabama was named after a Muslim?
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Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:


  1. There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
  2. The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
  3. Every sinner must repent of their sins.
  4. That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
  5. That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
  6. The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
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  #788  
Old 02-24-2008, 10:40 PM
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pelathais pelathais is offline
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Re: Why shouldn't I vote for Obama??

Quote:
Originally Posted by OP_Carl View Post
To make it relevant, what has Obama accomplished in the area of improving education?
As usual, OP_Carl goes directly to the heart of the matter. One needs to also ask, "What Obama accomplished at all?" After defeating the ex-husband of Seven-Of-Nine for the open senate seat, he's spent most of his first term running for president.

I'm sure he's a nice guy and all, but what's he ever done?

If he wins this thing he's going to be leaning very heavily upon his camp followers and glad handers. And that's where the flag waving Che come back into the discussion; along with everyone else who is convinced that he owes them a favor.
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  #789  
Old 02-25-2008, 05:48 AM
OP_Carl OP_Carl is offline
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Re: Why shouldn't I vote for Obama??

Quote:
Originally Posted by pelathais View Post
I'm sure he's a nice guy and all, but what's he ever done?
He has made great strides in educating the public about the proper methods of treatment for ladies that faint.


That counts as a two-fer: Education and Healthcare!
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Engineering solutions for theological problems.

Despite today's rising cost of living, it remains popular.

"It has been said that democracy is the worst form of government except all the others that have been tried." - Sir Winston Churchill

"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter." - Sir Winston Churchill

"They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security." - Benjamin Franklin
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  #790  
Old 02-25-2008, 09:14 AM
DividedThigh DividedThigh is offline
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Re: Why shouldn't I vote for Obama??

you guys be nice and stop insulting alabama, that is the home of the bear, lol,dt
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