Noah and the Ark

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by NotforSale

A relationship??? Uh, let me see, you have a relationship with someone you can't see, can't touch, and can't hear.

Years ago, before TV, Internet and phones that's all a lot of people had for relationships....

They wrote letters

Also your idea can't account for a spiritual relationship based on His presence in our lives and His ability to speak to us through other means than audible words

So yes we have a relationship based on His words. We talk to Him and He communicates to us through many ways

His word
Other people
Dreams/visons
thoughts
and His Spiritual presence in our lives

And BTW, sometimes people Do see His Glory and hear His voice.

[AR Pastor]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Years ago, before TV, Internet and phones that's all a lot of people had for relationships....

They wrote letters

Also your idea can't account for a spiritual relationship based on His presence in our lives and His ability to speak to us through other means than audible words

So yes we have a relationship based on His words. We talk to Him and He communicates to us through many ways

His word
Other people
Dreams/visons
thoughts
and His Spiritual presence in our lives

And BTW, sometimes people Do see His Glory and hear His voice.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Sasha

And that proves God put a rainbow in the sky as opposed to that being a natural happenstance?

The vapor canopy is a theory, but its collapse in would result in the first rainbow....a natural occurance

Genesis 1:6

Viewing the King James Version. Click to switch to 1611 King James Version of Genesis 1:6.


And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters(divider in the middle), and let it divide the waters from the waters.(ground level water from atmospheric water)

[NotforSale]

Originally Posted by Luke

You and I have talked about the issues you yourself have with what you claim to hold in highest regard ''physical evidence''. The problem is you yourself are true to own standard that you require of others when it comes to their beliefs. As in the other posts where we discussed this allow me to point out what I mean.

Physical evidence is defined in a legal context as:

''Physical evidence usually involves objects found at the scene of a crime. Physical evidence may consist of all sorts of prints such as fingerprints, footprints, handprints, tidemarks, cut marks, tool marks, etc. Examination of some physical evidence is conducted by making impressions in plaster, taking images of marks, or lifting the fingerprints from objects encountered'' this is from the following website (definitions.us legal.com)
Howere even though you require other people to produce physical evidence for their beliefs (otherwise you consider them foolish and blinded by belief) you believe in fear, joy, love, happiness, anger, and a host of other emotions all of which have no physical evidence for their existence.

Every one of those emotions requires, and is, in response to physical presence, and they have no life without it. These emotions are energy which can also be validated by the individual, and can be measured as a whole in Society.

Fear is Fear, whether you are Religious or not. Love is Love, whether you live in America now or in the past. Joy is felt by the Atheist and the Agnostic. Anger is seen in a Dictators speech or in a man who is protecting his Family from violence.

Experience will validate Truth.

No offense, but your argument is a moot point in this discussion, because everyone knows they have emotions that exist, regardless of who they are.

[NotforSale]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Years ago, before TV, Internet and phones that's all a lot of people had for relationships....

They wrote letters

Also your idea can't account for a spiritual relationship based on His presence in our lives and His ability to speak to us through other means than audible words

So yes we have a relationship based on His words. We talk to Him and He communicates to us through many ways

His word
Other people
Dreams/visons
thoughts
and His Spiritual presence in our lives

And BTW, sometimes people Do see His Glory and hear His voice.

Prax, I am through with peoples dreams and visions that go nowhere but the direction they want.

Spiritual presence, thoughts, other people? This is the road to isolated Theories that create a Cult, which benchmarks a Fact with Lies, deceiving those who follow such ideas.

Your analogy allows people to become the victim of no order, even though they think they have order.

[Luke]

Originally Posted by NotforSale

Every one of those emotions requires, and is, in response to physical presence, and they have no life without it.

What about those who have nightmares and are filled with terror even though there is no physical reason or dreams that fill one with happiness or what of hope that is simply the expectation that things will get better and requires no evidence? Emotions need nothing but the mind for life and as both philosophy and science have yet to prove that the mind even exist how can you believe in it. As one famous atheist said "we only think that we think" .

Originally Posted by NotforSale

These emotions are energy which can also be validated by the individual, and can be measured as a whole in Society.

So energy and emotions are one and the same. In light of that please explain paralyzing fear or the feeling of being drained of all energy?

Originally Posted by NotforSale

Fear is Fear, whether you are Religious or not. Love is Love, whether you live in America now or in the past. Joy is felt by the Atheist and the Agnostic. Anger is seen in a Dictators speech or in a man who is protecting his Family from violence.

God is God weather you are religious or not. It does not matter where you live or have lived God is still God.

Originally Posted by NotforSale

Experience will validate Truth.

Then how do you not discount all of the religious experience of people here and other places?

Originally Posted by NotforSale

No offense, but your argument is a moot point in this discussion, because everyone knows they have emotions that exist, regardless of who they are.

There is great debate as to weather or not emotions or even the mind actually exist. There is no physical evidence with which one can definitely prove the actual existance of emotions. Please explain irrational fear. With all due respect your argument is moot and void sense you have no physical evidence to offer us.

[AR Pastor]

I might can understand some of those here who call themselves Apostolic but to let an individual here who tears down God's Word is a disgrace.

We are not talking about different vies of scripture, but a person who deigns the scripture and mocks those who hold it dear.

[n david]

Originally Posted by NotforSale

A relationship??? Uh, let me see, you have a relationship with someone you can't see, can't touch, and can't hear.

That is the recipe for a mental disaster, where anything can be said about a relationship that isn't validated with anything but what you think. This is why there is so much confusion in the World in regards to Faith and God.

Human Beings require physical presence to develop healthy relationship(s), as the imagination is an endless vortex of Culture and ideologies developed as a child, which are used to interpret the unknown. Your God is not the God of the Native Americans, at least in thought.

Oh, and whether you like it or not, you are in a Religion. Try leaving and see what happens.

Nice try, I left the UPC long ago....and I still have many friends and even some family still in the UPC.

Not every has the experience you had.

And yes, I do have a relationship with a God I cannot physically see, touch or hear. But I can't see the wind, yet it's there. I can't touch the wind, but it still rustles the palms. Nor can I hear the wind, though it's effects are heard.

I'll keep this relationship I've had for the past 30 years. Nothing you say will ever cause me to doubt what I have seen, what I have felt and what I have heard.

[n david]

Originally Posted by AR Pastor

I might can understand some of those here who call themselves Apostolic but to let an individual here who tears down God's Word is a disgrace.

We are not talking about different vies of scripture, but a person who deigns the scripture and mocks those who hold it dear.

[MawMaw]

Originally Posted by AR Pastor

I might can understand some of those here who call themselves Apostolic but to let an individual here who tears down God's Word is a disgrace.

We are not talking about different vies of scripture, but a person who deigns the scripture and mocks those who hold it dear.

I agree!