Rejoicing In the Sabbath:

[Titus2woman]

Originally Posted by Aquila

I can agree with a lot of your concerns. But the decorations aren't the issue. The heart is.

We might to better to divorce any holiday association from Christ. Simply admit that Christmas is a cultural holiday that is more in line with our cultural tradtions than biblical facts.

I've said for years that if they would just make it 100% secular... call it 'the winter holiday' etc. I could feel as good about celebrating it as I do any other governmentaly sanctioned day off work... But those pesky Christians keep fighting that with the 'Let's keep Christ in Christmas' business as if He had ever actually been there,

... And while they are at it they could divorce 'Easter' with the vulgar fertility rites, etc. right along with it.

[Titus2woman]

Originally Posted by bbyrd009

Ok, I'm tryna quote "should have just waited for the rest," but instead I'm quoting something I don't even see that you've posted, hmm...ahh, ok...(other people's edits {reality, etc.}--I guess they do exist).

Payback

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Titus2woman

... And while they are at it they could divorce 'Easter' with the vulgar fertility rites, etc. right along with it.

Marshmellow peeps vulgar fertility right?

[Titus2woman]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Marshmellow peeps vulgar fertility right?

OOOOhhh... you hit me in my weak spot. Who could not love a PEEP?

[bbyrd009]

Ha the grossest part is it's all directed at the kids, of course.
Honey, we're killing the kids.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Titus2woman

OOOOhhh... you hit me in my weak spot. Who could not love a PEEP?

LOL

So glad it's "cultural".

[mfblume]

Sabbath is indeed kept today. BUT IT IS ONLY KEPT SPIRITUALLY in Christ. Jesus is our sabbath. Paul already dealt with this. He said sabbaths and new moons, etc., were shadows of the body of Christ. Since we have Christ now -- the body -- we have the TRUE sabbath. We have what cast the shadow. We still need a day of rest for our bodies, but it does not have to be the seventh day. Sabbath day was a memorial of OLD CREATION. We are new creatures now.

Colossians 2:16-17 KJV Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: (17) Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

The principle is: First is that which is natural, then afterwards is that which is spiritual (1 Cor 15:46). The spiritual is the true.

Paul never kept sabbath after his salvation, but went to synagogues on sabbath because that is where he could reach the most Jews to preach to them about Jesus.

He said he only did things under law in order to win people under law, not because God expected him to do it personally for God.

1 Corinthians 9:20 KJV And unto the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law;

And sabbath is not included in the commandments of Jesus. Jesus commanded things the Old Testament law and ten commandments never commanded. Read Matt 5 and see that he compared HIS commandments with Law.

Matthew 5:21-22 KJV Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment: (22) But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

Not only that, but Gal 4 shows Paul's fear for those keeping days, months and years, and these were OLD COVENANT holy times. He said Law was schoolmaster for ISRAEL ALONE, and only with them BEFORE Christ came. See Gal 3. And after faith came in Christ they are no longer under a schoolmaster. Chapter 4 carried the same thought on and said that since it was a schoolmaster for Jews who were under its bondage before Jesus, and Jews no longer should keep it, where did saved Gentiles get the idea that they should keep what the Jews are not even supposed to keep any more.

Galatians 3:22-4:11 KJV (22) But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe. (23) But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed. (24) Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. (25) But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster. (26) For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. (27) For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. (28) There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. (29) And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise. (4:1) Now I say, That the heir, as long as he is a child, differeth nothing from a servant, though he be lord of all; (2) But is under tutors and governors until the time appointed of the father. (3) Even so we, when we were children, were in bondage under the elements of the world: (4) But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law, (5) To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons. (6) And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father. (7) Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ. (8) Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, ye did service unto them which by nature are no gods. (9) But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage? (10) Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years. (11) I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain.

This was speaking about LAW keeping amongst gentile believers. Context from 3:325 proves this.

That is why he later said:

Galatians 5:1-4 KJV Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage. (2) Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. (3) For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law. (4) Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

Even back in chapter 4, he said Jews were in BONDAGE under the tutors and governors of Law.

Galatians 4:2-3 KJV But is under tutors and governors until the time appointed of the father. (3) Even so we, when we were children, were in bondage under the elements of the world:

The ELEMENTS of the world are referring to the LAW commandments in the sense of ELEMENTARY SCHOOL.

And the Gentiles were in a different form of bondage before Christ came when they served Idols.

Galatians 4:8 KJV Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, did service unto them which by nature are no gods.

And for Gentiles to keep Law's holy sabbath day was for them to go from one form of bondage under idols to another form of bondage under law when the Jews are not even supposed to be in bondage under law any more!

Galatians 4:9 KJV But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?

We know God only intended Israel to keep the sabbath day because it is from seventh sundown to first sundown of the next week, and the Inuit people in the Northern arctic regions see the sun stay above the horizon for months before it finally goes down.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Sabbath is indeed kept today. BUT IT IS ONLY KEPT SPIRITUALLY in Christ. Jesus is our sabbath. Paul already dealt with this. He said sabbaths and new moons, etc., were shadows of the body of Christ. Since we have Christ now -- the body -- we have the TRUE sabbath. We have what cast the shadow. We still need a day of rest for our bodies, but it does not have to be the seventh day. Sabbath day was a memorial of OLD CREATION. We are new creatures now.

Colossians 2:16-17 KJV Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: (17) Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

The principle is: First is that which is natural, then afterwards is that which is spiritual (1 Cor 15:46). The spiritual is the true.

You’re not telling our readers about lunar sabbaths nor that the feast days were often called “sabbaths”. Not every time we read the word “sabbaths” is the writer talking about the seventh day Sabbath of the LORD.

Paul never kept sabbath after his salvation, but went to synagogues on sabbath because that is where he could reach the most Jews to preach to them about Jesus.

The writer of Acts calls the Sabbath…”the sabbath”. Luke never writes, “their sabbath” or “the sabbath of the Jews”.

He said he only did things under law in order to win people under law, not because God expected him to do it personally for God.

1 Corinthians 9:20 KJV And unto the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law;

Totally different subject. Even in your paradigm, Paul keeps the Sabbath in Christ. Correct?

And sabbath is not included in the commandments of Jesus. Jesus commanded things the Old Testament law and ten commandments never commanded. Read Matt 5 and see that he compared HIS commandments with Law.

Matthew 5:21-22 KJV Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment: (22) But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

Ah…but you forget that Jesus is teaching rabbinically. Thus Jesus is interpreting the Law of God with reference to it pertaining to thought, word, and deed. In essence, Jesus is reminding them of the “spirit of the law”. Jesus isn’t nullifying the Law of God.

Not only that, but Gal 4 shows Paul's fear for those keeping days, months and years, and these were OLD COVENANT holy times.

Again, an indicator that Paul is taking about the “sabbaths” and the customs accompanying their observance in the Law of Moses. Not the Law of God.

He said Law was schoolmaster for ISRAEL ALONE, and only with them BEFORE Christ came. See Gal 3. And after faith came in Christ they are no longer under a schoolmaster. Chapter 4 carried the same thought on and said that since it was a schoolmaster for Jews who were under its bondage before Jesus, and Jews no longer should keep it, where did saved Gentiles get the idea that they should keep what the Jews are not even supposed to keep any more.

Again, the Law of Moses. It required the sacrifices for various violations that were intended to point them towards the Lamb of God who would take away the sin of the world. Paul isn’t writing about the Law of God.

Galatians 3:22-4:11 KJV (22) But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe. (23) But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed. (24) Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. (25) But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster. (26) For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. (27) For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. (28) There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. (29) And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise. (4:1) Now I say, That the heir, as long as he is a child, differeth nothing from a servant, though he be lord of all; (2) But is under tutors and governors until the time appointed of the father. (3) Even so we, when we were children, were in bondage under the elements of the world: (4) But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law, (5) To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons. (6) And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father. (7) Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ. (8) Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, ye did service unto them which by nature are no gods. (9) But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage? (10) Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years. (11) I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain.

This was speaking about LAW keeping amongst gentile believers. Context from 3:325 proves this.

Again, you’re not distinguishing between the Law of Moses and the Law of God.

That is why he later said:

Galatians 5:1-4 KJV Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage. (2) Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. (3) For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law. (4) Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

Circumcision is only found in the Law of Moses, not the Law of God (the Ten Commandments). Therefore, again, in context Paul is addressing the Law of Moses.

Also, Sabbath Keepers are not “justified” by the Law. We are led of the Holy Ghost to obey the Holy Law of God because we are saved unto good works. Faith without works is dead.

TO BE CONTINUED...

[Aquila]

CONTINUED...

Even back in chapter 4, he said Jews were in BONDAGE under the tutors and governors of Law.

Galatians 4:2-3 KJV But is under tutors and governors until the time appointed of the father. (3) Even so we, when we were children, were in bondage under the elements of the world:

The ELEMENTS of the world are referring to the LAW commandments in the sense of ELEMENTARY SCHOOL.

Again, Law of Moses. Not the Law of God.

And the Gentiles were in a different form of bondage before Christ came when they served Idols.

Galatians 4:8 KJV Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, did service unto them which by nature are no gods.

And for Gentiles to keep Law's holy sabbath day was for them to go from one form of bondage under idols to another form of bondage under law when the Jews are not even supposed to be in bondage under law any more!

Galatians 4:9 KJV But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?

Again, as with circumcision, for a Gentile to turn to the Law of Moses would be moving from one bondage to another. Not so with the Law of God (the Ten Commandments).

We know God only intended Israel to keep the sabbath day because it is from seventh sundown to first sundown of the next week, and the Inuit people in the Northern arctic regions see the sun stay above the horizon for months before it finally goes down.

What’s a Jew to do in the northern arctic regions?! LOL

I have a few questions for you….

Rev. Blume,

John wrote:

1 John 3:4
Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

Sin is defined as being “transgression of the law”. Can you tell me what “law” John is writing about? The Law of Moses or the Law of God?

Is the “Law” carnal, or spiritual???

HEB. 7:16 Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, but after the power of an endless life.

Spiritual
ROM. 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.

Does the “Law” judge no man, or does the “Law” judge all men?

COL. 2:14-16 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it. Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

JAM. 2:10-12 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all. For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law. So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.

Is the “Law” contrary to us, or is the “Law” not grevious?

COL. 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross.

1 JOHN 5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

Is there no perfection in the “Law”, or is the “Law” perfect?

HEB. 7:19 For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God.

PSALMS 19:7 The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.

Did the “Law” end, or will it endure until the eternal state?
[INDENT]EPH. 2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace.

LUKE 16:17 And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail.[/QUOTE]

Lastly, God stated that He would write His “Law” upon our hearts. Is the Law of God written upon our hearts to obey its precepts, or is the “Law” no longer applicable under the New Covenant?

Jeremiah 31:33
33But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

Without drawing a distinction between the Law of God and the Law of Moses we have utter confusion. This is why we have so many silly standards with no moral compass. What you are proposing is an Antinomianist heresy. We need a sure standard. Again, John wrote:

1 John 3:4
Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

What “law” is John speaking about? The Law of God, the Ten Commandments. This is the opinion of the early church including the Ante-Nicene Fathers:

"Have before thine eyes the fear of God, and always remember the ten commandments of God, - to love the one and only Lord God with all thy strength; to give no heed to idols, or any other beings, as being lifeless gods, or irrational beings or demons. Consider the manifold workmanship of God, which received its beginning through Christ. Thou shalt observe the Sabbath, on account of Him who ceased from His work of creation, but ceased not from His work of providence; it is a rest for meditation of the law, not for the idleness of the hands." (Ante-Nicene Fathers, Volume 7, p. 413, 1951 edition).

Repent Rev. Blume. You’re making the Word of God of none effect through your Antinomian doctrine. Without a sure standard for sin (a law whereby we might know sin) we are lost on a sea of relativism that leaves us in bondage to the arbitrary whims of legalistic pastors.

[bbyrd009]

REVEREND Blume. Dang. I appreciate your argument, but the dearth of the actual word Sabbath in that slavery-pointing-out quote just seems to point to other observances of "days, and months, and times, and years..." seems like the...annulment? of a Command would come a bit more officially.

Please understand that I would prefer to not have a wall between me and you pagan, misguided, Sunday-shleppers, though; I will keep praying for you (from my position, On High : ) ok, a low wall.
electrified.
oh, and can you keep your kids away from my kids?
lol