Tithing…Is it a command?

[NotforSale]

Originally Posted by Crossfire

Yes, I fellowship on Sunday. No, I do not celebrate pagan holy days. I actually go to church everytime I get the chance. It is not a matter of the exact date, so much as it is the worship. But, your entire argument is completely flawed.

I didn't ask you if you "fellowshipped". I asked you if you went to Church on Sunday.

Do you accept presents at Christmas time? Do you accept the Holiday pay (money) from your job at Christmas? Do you gather with relatives during the Holiday season? Do you decorate?

Do you participate in the marriage ceremony? Were you married by traditional marriage law and vows?

Do you celebrate Birthdays?

Do you consider people who celebrate Christmas, pagan?

[gloryseeker]

Originally Posted by Jason

I always have did things according to the word. Truth be told, years ago I was a cashier, I hated doing that. But reading the Word, it said work as unto the Lord.

You make a good point here that I agree with, although not the topic of this thread. Tithing is not an "end all" to walking in the blessings of the Lord. There are many things...faithfulness, giving God glory for promotions, working as unto the Lord, etc. All of these play into our ability to walk in blessings.

I guess where I differ from you, is that the promises associated with the tithe makes me immune from the conditions of the world. You brought up those losing their homes, cars, etc. There is no failure or lack in God. Therefore, it does not matter what is going on around me if I live according to all that God has commanded.

Which brings me back to the part of my post you did not answer

I was talking to a guy one time who didn't believe in the infilling of the Holy Spirit, speaking tongues, and such. His explanation of the scriptures was that when a person accepts the Lord he is "filled" with the Spirit. I would ask, what about (give a scripture), how about (give a scripture), etc. Every scripture that talked about the infilling he had a reason why that didn't apply to the conversation.

Talking to someone who doesn't see the tithe as part of God's system is the same way. You say you are begging for scripture, but if you just scroll through this thread and the multitude of other threads about tithing you will find a lot of scriptural references....you just don't see, won't accept it, or disagree with the scripture.

It's a mute point to post them again.

[gloryseeker]

Originally Posted by Crossfire

The tithe as we know it today, is a false doctrine instituted by the Roman Catholic Church, and was brought into the true church by converts from the false religion. There is absolutely no scriptural support for this false doctrine. Teachers/Preachers/Ministers who teach this doctrine of a tax on being a believers are frauding the people of God and will stand before God for their lies.

At least hide your ignorance by saying it's Old Testament or something. We can trace tithing back, at the very least to Abraham, who was around long before the Catholic church ever existed.

[Crossfire]

No, GS, your ignorance is showing quite through.

The tithe as we know it today, was an invention of the Roman Catholic Church. It was a tax levied on believers, and based upon the tenth principle of the agricultural tithe of the Old Testament. It is a farce, a lie, and a fraud to declare the mandatory payment of a tenth of one's income because one is a believer.

The Roman Catholic Church even admits their inventing of the tithe. The early church did not tithe. Those preachers who declare tithing as scriptural for the Church are frauding God's people.

If one does not believe me, look at the Catholic Encyclopedia. The online version speaks rather openly about how the RCC invented the tithe doctrine, and how the early church gave out of their heart, not of tithing.

[Crossfire]

Originally Posted by NotforSale

I didn't ask you if you "fellowshipped". I asked you if you went to Church on Sunday.

Do you accept presents at Christmas time? Do you accept the Holiday pay (money) from your job at Christmas? Do you gather with relatives during the Holiday season? Do you decorate?

Do you participate in the marriage ceremony? Were you married by traditional marriage law and vows?

Do you celebrate Birthdays?

Do you consider people who celebrate Christmas, pagan?

When one is confronted by their sins, one will use every excuse to validate it. This is what I am seeing in so many so-called churches today. Men are willing to stay in paganism because they love pleasing their flesh. They love preaching tithing because they love fraud and making the money.

Your questions are meaningless, NFS, because you refuse to deal with the issue of the tithe being a lie, and the preacher who demand the mandatory tithe guilty of lying on God and His Word.

[gloryseeker]

Originally Posted by Crossfire

No, GS, your ignorance is showing quite through.

The tithe as we know it today, was an invention of the Roman Catholic Church. It was a tax levied on believers, and based upon the tenth principle of the agricultural tithe of the Old Testament. It is a farce, a lie, and a fraud to declare the mandatory payment of a tenth of one's income because one is a believer.

The Roman Catholic Church even admits their inventing of the tithe. The early church did not tithe. Those preachers who declare tithing as scriptural for the Church are frauding God's people.

If one does not believe me, look at the Catholic Encyclopedia. The online version speaks rather openly about how the RCC invented the tithe doctrine, and how the early church gave out of their heart, not of tithing.

And Al Gore admits he invented the internet

[Crossfire]

In the Christian Church, as those who serve the altar should live by the altar (1 Corinthians 9:13), provision of some kind had necessarily to be made for the sacred ministers. In the beginning this was supplied by the spontaneous offerings of the faithful. In the course of time, however, as the Church expanded and various institutions arose, it became necessary to make laws which would insure the proper and permanent support of the clergy. The payment of tithes was adopted from the Old Law, and early writers speak of it as a divine ordinance and an obligation of conscience. The earliest positive legislation on the subject seems to be contained in the letter of the bishops assembled at Tours in 567 and the canons of the Council of Maçon in 585. In course of time, we find the payment of tithes made obligatory by ecclesiastical enactments in all the countries of christendom. The Church looked on this payment as "of divine law, since tithes were instituted not by man but by the Lord Himself" (C. 14, X de decim. III, 30).

Direct quote from http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/14741b.htm.

Your entire argument for the continued frauding of the saints has no scripture, and been exposed as a lie.

[The Lemon]

I have been reading this post this morning and I just want to say that there is no need for personal attacks on here. Glory Seeker and Not For Sale have a right to express their views without someone railing on them.

I am not in total agreement with all that has been said on this topic, however, I know for sure that Not For Sale is a pastor, a man of God who is doing his best for God - I am sure that Glory Seeker is as well.

I think it is healthy to debate and talk about scripture to seek out truth from the Word of God. It is counter productive to make personal attacks on people that we do not know on a personal level. Also, I would be very careful slamming any man of God who is trying to lead the flock. I realize there are disagreements with those who promote pay the Tithe or go to Hell...but unless I missed something, I have not seen those words promoted by these brethren.

If those of us that do not believe that not paying Tithes will not put us in Hell, then we also can not then say that they are leading the flock to Hell for preaching the Tithe....unless they do some serious perverting and admit to believing that you can buy your way into Heaven.

At any rate, I do not want to see either side of this issue become personal insults that foster no edification at all. We can disagree without running people off. I have said this before....we need to have a balance.

I am not trying to appear hypocritical, just trying to keep this from falling off the cliff.

[Truthseeker]

No one teaches biblical tithes. It's a watered down twisted version today.

[Neck]

Originally Posted by gloryseeker

At least hide your ignorance by saying it's Old Testament or something. We can trace tithing back, at the very least to Abraham, who was around long before the Catholic church ever existed.

Is it about tithing or the concept? Or is it about are we accurately applying the concept? As practiced by Abraham and the Children of Israel starting with the days of Abraham. My thoughts are the way it is preached today the answer to that question is no.

The practice today is a simple 10% of your paycheck.

That is not close to the practice or the concept.

I'll let anyone who is a tithing scholar lay it out for us.