Spring Festivals

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Eliseus

1Timothy 1:8 But we know that the law [is] good, if a man use it lawfully;

The feasts were most certainly shadows of Christ and His glorious Work. I don't know any true Christian who would deny that.

That is a far cry, though, from saying 'Gentiles should not celebrate the feasts'.

I cannot see Paul intending anything else in gal 3 through 4.

First of all, in the New Covenant, THERE IS NEITHER JEW NOR GENTILE. So there is no such thing as a 'Gentile Christian' or a 'Jewish Christian' except in reference to what a person was BEFORE they became a Christian. In Christ, ALL things are made new...

That wads what I meant by speaking to Galatians. They were FORMERLY Gentiles. That was the context of Paul's words to them.

Our family has observed PAssover for several years (I think you already knew that, brother Blume...?) This is the first year we actually followed anything remotely approaching a traditional method of doing so.

Actually I am unaware of who your family even is. lol.

We kept it for the two purposes given in Scripture - to teach our children, and in remembrance of the Lord.

It served as an excellent opportunity to teach by both word and example (action) the history of Deliverance, Passover, the Lamb, applying the blood, the final sacrifice of Christ, the Lord's Supper and what it connotates (one cup, one loaf - the afikomen - which represents one covenant, one body, one sacrifice of which we all partake, etc etc etc.)

Jesus kept PAssover, and said 'Do this in remembrance of me', which is just what we as a family have tried to do, and will continue to do.

The Lord's Supper was BASED UPON Passover, but I do not think it was Passover. Passover foreshadowed the work of the cross, which the Lord's Supper revealed. We take COMMUNION many times throughout the year. Not just AT PASSOVER time in the spring. In Fact, Communion is said to be "as oft" as the church did it. IOW< it did not restrict it to passover time. So I do not think it is Passover in the strict sense you may be implying it is.

Moses said the Passover was to be kept in remembrance of the deliverance from Egypt. Our Lord said we were to keep that memorial ( the memorial in remembrance of the Exodus) IN MEMORY OF HIM. Paul said that by doing so we show forth His death until His return.

To suggest that 'Gentile Christians should not keep PAssover' is simply to suggest that 'Gentile Christians should not keep the Lord's Supper', because the twain are the same.

I disagree for reasons noted above. When we have Communion we do not announce that we are having Passover. We have the Lord's Supper which is based upon the foreshadow of Passover, which supper is in itself symbolic.

But I think you may have missed my point. Paul was speaking about keeping these days HOLY. Christians have no HOLY DAYS, MONTHS or YEARS. That was the context. Feasts of Israel were only HOLY DAYS, required by Law to be kept holy. We simply are not under that legality.

I hope that clarifies things.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by HaShaliach

Mike - I understand your position and have no difficulty with it. Of course, Passover, the Feast of Unleavened Bread, The Festival of Weeks , Shavu'ot, etc, are not Jewish holidays or Holy days.

I am not sure if I agree with you here.

Adam Clarke said this of the verse in question, and I am not proposing he is right on all his counts about everything he writes:

Gal 4:10
Ye observe days - Ye superstitiously regard the Sabbaths and particular days of your own appointment;

And months - New moons; times - festivals, such as those of tabernacles, dedication, passover, etc.

Years - Annual atonements, sabbatical years, and jubilees.

I agree with Clarke. I came to the same conclusions in my personal study. I feel Gal 4:10-11 is greatly misunderstood. Context demands it refer to the feasts of Israel, I sincerely believe.

Barnes said the same thing.

Days - The days here referred to are doubtless the days of the Jewish festivals. They had numerous days of such observances, and in addition to those specified in the Old Testament, the Jews had added many others as days commemorative of the destruction and rebuilding of the temple, and of other important events in their history.

The DAYS of the feasts were holy days, were they not? If not, what else from the Law would the holy days be referring to as the elementary schoolmaster lessons that Law gave to Israel before the cross?

And, when Jesus returns to earth and establishes His kingdom, anyone who does not observe the fall harvest festival of Sukkot (the Festival of Booths), will be cursed of God. If we are all going to be required to celebrate this festival, we might as well get some understanding as to what it is all about. Right?

I do not believe in premillennialism, and therefore propose there is no physical kingdom to come on the earth since Jesus said it is in you, and does not come with observation. He never said it ever would. These prophecies are speaking of the spiritual application of the feasts in everyday Christian living.

Perhaps, as you have already alluded to, there just might be more to this kind of study than meets the eye. Reading the New Testament from an Apostolic world view puts some of what has been general believed by the Western Gentile thinking Christians in a very different context. It is something akin to translating Shakespeare's works into Chinese and expecting an Asian reader to be able to truly understand and appreciate Shakespeare's works without the benefit of knowing British history, culture, or language. While not impossible to over come, this lack of knowledge does pose some very real interpretation problems for the Asian reader.

For starters, remove the page that is titled "New Testament", think of the four Gospels as one book called 3th Kings, The book of Acts is actually 3ed Chronicles, and Revelation is still Revelation. All of the Epistles then become the God inspired Commentary to the existing Word of God - there is nothing "new" in the New Testament, that has not already been identified in the "old". (Revelation being the promised expansion of the writings of Daniel.)

I can see that. But probably not in the manner you do. And that is fine.

However, carefully studying Paul's words in Gal 3 through 4 leads me to understand everything of the Old Covenant was typological of the spiritual realities in Christ, and not meant to be literally repeated in the church nor in a future millennium. They were elementary ABC building blocks. Just as we use the principles learned in elementary school regarding the ABC's in our real lives, the feast days were intended to only convey a principle which we engage in during our Christianity, while not actually playing with the principle ABC's forevermore.

God bless, and thanks for reading!

[A.W. Bowman]

Looking for some self-improvement teaching material for home or church? Try this:

I will post a couple of these to get us started, but, if anyone is interest in this part of the study, they will have to subscribe to get the daily reminder AND the included "A Spiritual Guide to the Counting of the Omer", The Forty-Nine Steps to Personal Refinement: Courtesy of www.MeaningfulLife.com

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B"H

Nissan 13, 5768 * April 18, 2008
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This Sunday night we count one day of the Omer, followed by Monday night when we count two days of the Omer.

For detailed instructions on how to count the Omer, blessing text, omer calendar, and more information, go to: http://www.chabad.org/holidays/sefirah/omer-count.asp.

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A Spiritual Guide to the Counting of the Omer
Forty-Nine Steps to Personal Refinement
Courtesy of www.MeaningfulLife.com
* * *

Week one - Chesed

Love is the single most powerful and necessary component in life. Love is the origin and foundation of all human interactions. It is both giving and receiving. It allows us to reach above and beyond ourselves. To experience another person and to allow that person to experience us. It is the tool by which we learn to experience the highest reality - G-d. In a single word: love is transcendence.


Day One: Chesed of chesed

Examine the love aspect of love. The expression of love and its level of intensity. Everyone has the capacity to love in their hearts. The question is if and how we actualize and express it.

Ask yourself:

What is my capacity to love another person? Do I have problems with giving? Am I stingy or selfish? Is it difficult for me to let someone else into my life? Do I have room for someone else? Do I allow room for someone else? Am I afraid of my vulnerability, of opening up and getting hurt? How do I express love? Am I able to communicate my true feelings? Do I withhold expressing love out of fear of reaction? Or on the contrary: I often express too much too early. Do others misunderstand my intentions?

Whom do I love? Do I only love those that I relate to and who relate to me? Do I have the capacity to love a stranger; to lend a helping hand to someone I don't know? Do I express love only when it's comfortable?

Why do I have problems with love and what can I do about it? Does my love include the other six aspects of chesed, without which love will be distorted and unable to be truly realized.


Day Two: Gevurah of Chesed

Healthy love must always include an element of discipline. A degree of distance and respect for the other. An assessment of the persons capacity to contain your love. Love must be tempered and directed properly. Ask a parent who in the name of love has spoiled his child; or someone who suffocates their spouse with love and doesn't allow her any space of her own. Love with discretion is necessary to avoid giving to those that don't deserve it.

Is my love disciplined enough? Do others take advantage of my giving nature? Am I hurting anyone by becoming their crutch in the name of love? Am I hurting my children by forcing upon them my value system because I love them so? Do I respect the one I love or is it a selfish love? Am I sensitive to his feelings and attitudes? Do I see my beloved as an extension of myself and my needs? In my love is there as much emphasis on the one I love and his ability to contain my love as there is on me and my giving? Rain is a blessing only because it falls in drops that don't flood the fields.

Exercise for the day: Help someone on their terms not on yours. Apply yourself to their specific needs even if it takes effort.




Nissan 17, 5768 * April 22, 2008
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C O U N T T H E O M E R R E M I N D E R
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Tonight, Tuesday night, April 22, 2008, we count three days of the Omer.

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Day Three: Tiferet of Chesed

There is love and there is beautiful love. True love includes empathy and compassion which makes it a beautiful love. Love is often fostered in expectation of reciprocity. Real love is expressed even when one gets nothing in return; even when the other doesn't deserve love. Tiferet is giving also to those that have hurt you. It acknowledges the discipline of gevurah and says that, nevertheless, compassionate love calls for helping all.

Exercise for the day: Offer a helping hand to a stranger.

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For detailed instructions on how to count the Omer, blessing text, omer calendar, and more information, go to: http://www.chabad.org/holidays/sefirah/omer-count.asp.

Count the Omer the high-tech way! Subscribe to our Omer Reminder list and we will send you an email every evening reminding you to fulfill this special Mitzvah!

Just follow this link:

http://www.chabad.org/autosub.asp?Us...3924,124699,16

[A.W. Bowman]

By Rabbi Kalman Packouz Insights into life, ideas for personal growth.
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GOOD MORNING! This Shabbat coincides with the Seventh Day of Pesach, a full-fledged holiday which extends to Sunday evening, the April 27th. The crossing of the Yam Soof, usually translated as the Red Sea, more correctly translated as "The Reed Sea" or "Sea of Reeds," took place on this day. And thus continued the 50 day journey of self-perfection until the giving of the Torah on Mt. Sinai.

How do we begin to improve ourselves? It starts with a decision to change. What if you had a special clock on top of your television that was counting down the hours and minutes until you were to die? When would you get up, turn off the TV and do all the things that you planned to do, hoped to do or in passing thought about doing?

And what if in addition to your special clock, you had a special bank account where every morning you were credited in your bank account with $86,400 dollars on condition that you had to spend it all or lose it? What would you do? Spend it!! Well, you do have a special bank account called the Bank of Time! Each day you have exactly 86,400 seconds. What you don't invest wisely is written off each night. You can reap dividends, but you can't go into overdraft!

One has to value his time and know that it is limited in order to change. The Sephirat HaOmer period is about valuing time and about changing

[A.W. Bowman]

I really appreciate your responses, Mike. As usual you have done on outstanding job in communicating your thoughts and position(s). In no way will I attempt to make any so-called “corrective comments”.

For clarification sake, where I made some statements/ assertions without sound scriptural support I add the following:

Jewish holidays consist of such observances as the Fast of the first Born and Hanukah. These kinds of holidays are by and for Jews. The three major feasts and most of the other observances are holy convocations and seasons appointed by God, and are holy unto Him, and imposed upon His chosen people for specific purposes. See Le 23 for examples. In all of the O.T. mandated days of observances, God identified them as His holy days, not days established for the Jews.

It is true that not all things Jewish are for the Gentile Christian, and not all things commanded can be performed by all men world-wide. However, there are a good number of things to be learned and to be observed, as you pointed out.

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Another unsupported statement concerned the required observance of the Feast of Booths, or tabernacles, also called Succoth or Cukkowth after the return of the Lord.

All of Zech 14, with emphases on verses 16-21 ¶ And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations that came against Jerusalem shall go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD [Y’hovah ] of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.
17 And it shall be, that whoso of the families of the earth goeth not up unto Jerusalem to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, upon them there shall be no rain.
18 And if the family of Egypt go not up, and come not, they shall have no overflow; there shall be the plague, wherewith the LORD will smite the nations that go not up to keep the feast of tabernacles.
19 This shall be the punishment of Egypt, and the punishment of all the nations that go not up to keep the feast of tabernacles.
20 In that day shall there be upon the bells of the horses: HOLY UNTO THE LORD; and the pots in the LORD’S house shall be like the basins before the altar.
21 Yea, every pot in Jerusalem and in Judah shall be holy unto the LORD of hosts; and all they that sacrifice shall come and take of them, and seethe therein; and in that day there shall be no more a trafficker in the house of the LORD of hosts.

All of these things require the “Third Jerusalem Temple” and the sitting of The King of Kings.

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One point that you brought up is truly worthy of much greater consideration than most of us have given to it in the past:

… carefully studying Paul's words in Gal 3 through 4 leads me to understand everything of the Old Covenant was typological of the spiritual realities in Christ.

The other way this is usually expressed is, “The Old Testament is types and shadows of the reality which is in Christ Jesus.” These statements are, of course, correct – in as far as they go. What is almost never taught is, what are those “realities”?

For example, what is the actual reality in Christ of the Passover? Shavu’ot? Succoth? The Torah and Tanakh? Etc. And, how are all of these kinds of things fulfilled in Christ? Then, that begs the question, how are these realities to be identified and applied to the lives of Christians (Gentile and Jew)?

You have started a wonderful new subject for investigation. I am looking forward to reading your teaching. I know you will do well!

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by HaShaliach

One point that you brought up is truly worthy of much greater consideration than most of us have given to it in the past: The other way this is usually expressed is, “The Old Testament is types and shadows of the reality which is in Christ Jesus.” These statements are, of course, correct – in as far as they go. What is almost never taught is, what are those “realities”?

For example, what is the actual reality in Christ of the Passover? Shavu’ot? Succoth? The Torah and Tanakh? Etc. And, how are all of these kinds of things fulfilled in Christ? Then, that begs the question, how are these realities to be identified and applied to the lives of Christians (Gentile and Jew)?

You have started a wonderful new subject for investigation. I am looking forward to reading your teaching. I know you will do well!

Thanks for your kind approach to my thoughts. It is a breath of fresh air. lol.

Exactly how these feasts are applied to Christian lives spiritually is indeed the point we all must understand. Since the feasts are building blocks like the ABC's of children's toys, I feel we are not to actually keep those feasts. I believe Paul's words in Gal 4:10-11 indicate they were restricted to Israel and not to all nations. However, careful and prayerful analysis of the feasts, combined with studying the obvious types noted in the New Testament teachings concerning how we are to carry our everyday lives as believers, will reveal the how's.

Folks such as yourself would be a great asset in determining those how's, by seeing in your words about the feasts the spiritual messages that would be translated into spiritual applications in our lives as believers.

I have done some study on the issue and noted, for example that the feasts are a progressive picture of our maturity in Christ to where we are finally the TABERNACLE OF GOD through which God can manifest Himself fully out into the world and to the people around us.

Revelation is laid out in a literary fashion after the pattern of the feasts.

The first reference is the holy sabbath day in Lev 23, and John was in the Spirit on the Lord's day.

Passover then commences, and we see the picture of John having to TURN, in chapter 1, to see the voice speaking to Him. When he turned, he saw the candlestick of the tabernacle. In order to view the candlestick directly behind you, you have to be facing the NORTH while inside the holy place, where the TABLE OF SHEWBREAD IS LOCATED. The table used bread and wine. Passover details.

And this goes on and on through all the feasts in Revelation. But the end of Revelation shows the TABERNACLE OF GOD IS WITH MEN.... Tabernacles was the final feast, and we see this in the end of Revelation as well. It's, as you know, the Israelite celebration of the Exodus journey of escape from Egypt into their own promised land. They USED to dwell in booths, but now are in their cities, especially Jerusalem, just as Revelation shows a spiritual Exodus from spiritual Egypt, where our Lord was crucified (Rev 11:8), to wind up in NEW Jerusalem at the end, when TABERNACLE OF GOD is mentioned.

I believe this shows the end of our journey in GLORY just as Israel ended their journey in the Land with Jerusalem in their possession.

As you said, this deserves another thread of its own.

[A.W. Bowman]

Mike -

We have crossed posts many times - but I never recall a time when one or both of us did not learn something of value in the exchange.

Over the years you have earned the respect of a great many people - even those who may have strongly disagreed with you over some issue or another. What generates that response is your expressed desire not to "be right", but to find and expose "truth". That is a rare quality, and I state that publicly.

Concerning the partial list of subjects I posted: These are the kind of discussion we should be engaging in, not who we judge to be fit for heaven or other such silly debates. You can judge which subjects are worth expending spiritual energy on and those debates design only for the playing of spiritual games (no value).

My plate is overflowing for at least the next several months, that is why I suggested that you take the lead in pushing forward in these kinds of investigations. However, I would not saddle you with that full responsibility (unless you just happen to have the time and energy) to go forth alone in this effort.

There should be (and I know that there are) a number of members on this forum who are well qualified to lead such "real studies" and dig into the meat of the word. For me: As a self-professed teacher, my first responsibility is to remain teachable (i.e., a good student). Therefore, I look forward to being both instructed, and from time to time being able to contribute something to the discussions.

Be at peace, brother.

Ha Shaliach, do you have an online copy of the haggadah you use?

Just wondering.

[A.W. Bowman]

I use a couple of different printed ones, but, this on-line series should do you well: Passover How To