Loren Yadon's: Tragedies of War????

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by Innocuous

Yes, I agree. It's a systemic problem, imo. Hence, my decision to leave. But I still mourn a little over the loss and wish it could be different.

How would you change the system if you could?

[Sam]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

...
So, to recap what I believe - Your sins are forgiven at repentance and remitted at Baptism.
...
.

But, the word translated "remission" in Acts 2:38 is translated "forgiveness" in other places in the KJV.
And, in some versions of the Bible, the word "forgiveness" is used in Acts 2:38.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by mizpeh

IMO, the new birth is complete by obeying Acts 2:38 but the new birth is not salvation. Salvation and justification are processes we go through until we are handed that crown of life. Here's a short video by a Reformed Evangelical that describes salvation. I would disagree with him when he says justification is a one time event because the Bible speaks of it in past, present, and future tenses as well. Gal 2:17, Rom 5:1, Rom 5:9, 1 Cor 6:11, Titus 3:7.

I'm not sure that I can agree that Acts 2:38 is not salvation. I know that we must continue in the common salvation (Jude 1:3) - holding that truth - but to say it is not salvation - not sure about that.

Mainly, because of the account in Acts 16 when the Keeper of the Prison asks Paul, "What must we do to be saved?"

I believe staying saved is a work that we need to do - "...faith without works is dead", which implies a continuance after our initial response, i.e., repentance, baptism, infilling.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Sam

But, the word translated "remission" in Acts 2:38 is translated "forgiveness" in other places in the KJV.
And, in some versions of the Bible, the word "forgiveness" is used in Acts 2:38.

Then we have to clearly conclude that you must do both - repent AND be baptized - to be forgiven. It doesn't just settle on repentance alone.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by mizpeh

IMO, the new birth is complete by obeying Acts 2:38 but the new birth is not salvation. Salvation and justification are processes we go through until we are handed that crown of life. Here's a short video by a Reformed Evangelical that describes salvation. I would disagree with him when he says justification is a one time event because the Bible speaks of it in past, present, and future tenses as well. Gal 2:17, Rom 5:1, Rom 5:9, 1 Cor 6:11, Titus 3:7.

I had to think about this and I may not put my thoughts out in a very articulate way, but I don't believe that justification is a process. Unless I'm missing a larger picture. I view it as more a legal term. The scriptures that I read seem to bear out a state you can be judged by being brought along by other processes. It wasn't the justification doing that, but the processes.

In other words, when we grow in "wisdom" we are justified and saved in that process, but I wouldn't define justification as "the process".

I would define, "wisdom", for example, as "the process" that makes you remain justified and saved. Actually, any fruit of the spirit would be "the process" to keep you justified and saved, IMO - "....add to your faith virtue, and to virtue knowledge, etc. These are "the processes" wherein you will be justified - the state of being justified.

And I don't believe that our "salvation" is a process. Our growing in the grace and knowledge of the Lord Jesus Christ is a process. We can't get any more saved after our initial repentance, baptism and infilling. We can lose our salvation by not holding onto our "common salvation", but our process comes from growing and perfection/maturity, IMO.

[stmatthew]

The earnest of our inheritance (eternal life) is given to us when we are Born Again.

[Innocuous]

Originally Posted by mizpeh

Hmmm, I guess that is a compliment?

Yes, it is. You're sharp.

[Innocuous]

Originally Posted by mizpeh

How would you change the system if you could?

Well, I guess that depends on the meaning of 'if you could'. Does that mean that I'd actually be able influence positive change in the org or that I'd merely have the position/opportunity to attempt change. Barring a miraculous intervention of God I don't think the former is possible, the problems are systemic and the various camps are entrenched. You couldn't pay me enough to do the latter, it'd be a waste of time and energy.

[Pastor Keith]

Originally Posted by Sam

But, the word translated "remission" in Acts 2:38 is translated "forgiveness" in other places in the KJV.
And, in some versions of the Bible, the word "forgiveness" is used in Acts 2:38.

Sam,

Knowing that, how does that factor in Pastoral application or counseling a inquirer regarding the How to become a Christian in your mind?

[TRFrance]

Originally Posted by Innocuous

You know Miz, for a woman you sure know you're theology. (hehe, i enjoy being a chauvanistic sexist pig every once in awhile. . love ya and admire ya. )

^^^Politically Incorrect Post of The Week.