Why does God Allow ______? Fill in the Blank

[notofworks]

Originally Posted by Flutecrafter

*shrugs*
Don't like it?
Take it up with God.
I 'spect He knows somewhat better than you.

Originally Posted by Timmy

I have no words.

I have plenty but I can't say them on the public part of the Forum.

[Flutecrafter]

Originally Posted by Twisp

Job's free will to curse God has nothing to do with God letting him go through those hard times. God could have stopped it but allowed it to happen.

You can't say that God is all powerful and has a plan for everyone, and then say that our lives are out of His control. The scriptures do not bear that out.

absolutely, for our lives are not out of His control, or rather, His ability to control.
God does, however, choose to guide rather than make us automatons.

[MissBrattified]

I'm a little confused about something here...

How does not understanding WHY God does things lead to a belief that He must not exist, or that if He does, He doesn't care for or interact with humanity?

How do you get from point A to point B?

What does not understanding God have to do with His proposed existence and sovereignty?

[notofworks]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

I'm a little confused about something here...

How does not understanding WHY God does things lead to a belief that He must not exist, or that if He does, He doesn't care for or interact with humanity?

How do you get from point A to point B?

What does not understanding God have to do with His proposed existence and sovereignty?

I don't think it's that simple. Point A is connected to Point B, but I would imagine that the road between the two points covers C, D, E, F, G, and maybe all the rest of the letters.

[nahkoe]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

I'm a little confused about something here...

How does not understanding WHY God does things lead to a belief that He must not exist, or that if He does, He doesn't care for or interact with humanity?

How do you get from point A to point B?

What does not understanding God have to do with His proposed existence and sovereignty?

Because. If it is evil to allow someone to harm a young child, and God allows this to happen, then God is evil. Whether or not that argument is *true* it is *valid*. One can only conclude that if God allows things, then God is evil. Or, God doesn't really allow things or doesn't even exist at all. I allow for yet another option, that for some reason I don't understand, bad stuff happens and somehow, God really is involved with humankind, but I haven't been able to figure out how He can be all powerful (as claimed), *and* involved with humankind, *and* bad stuff still happens.

[TruWorshp]

Originally Posted by nahkoe

Because. If it is evil to allow someone to harm a young child, and God allows this to happen, then God is evil. Whether or not that argument is *true* it is *valid*. One can only conclude that if God allows things, then God is evil. Or, God doesn't really allow things or doesn't even exist at all. I allow for yet another option, that for some reason I don't understand, bad stuff happens and somehow, God really is involved with humankind, but I haven't been able to figure out how He can be all powerful (as claimed), *and* involved with humankind, *and* bad stuff still happens.

Well, someone once said that the negative things are the absence of positive things. They can't overtake the good things in life. Think of it this way; darkness is the absence of light. When you have darkness, it's just darkness. With light, you can obtain black light, blue light, red light, bright light, dim light, etc. If there is no light, it's just "darkness". The same goes for God and the world. What we know as "evil" is truly just the absence of having God in your life. And many times that bad things happen to us, especially those of us who consider ourselves children of God, we don't understand, because we wonder, "What have I ever done to deserve this?". It is in our human nature to automatically think that everything that happens to us happens because of our deeds. However, that is often not the case. A lot of the time God allows bad things to happen to His children to test them, or so they can help someone else through a similar situation. I knew someone who was going through a very difficult time in her life, and one day she was sitting down, and began to question God about her circumstances and her life which seemed to be falling apart. God answered her, and told her that He was allowing her to go through everything so she could help others, and be able to understand from their perspective. Not too long after that revelation, she was called to be a missionary. So, Jesus always knows what He's doing, even when we think that maybe there's a better way of doing it. We try hard to understand God and His ways, but in truth, no one can ever truly understand the Lord, for we only have mortal minds and cannot comprehend half the things he does or half of who He is. But just know that He is going to cause all the bad things that happen to us to be good for us, whether we see it now or not. Just trust Him.

[Falla39]

Job 34:21-37 (KJV)

21 For his eyes are upon the ways of man, and he seeth all his goings.

22 There is no darkness, nor shadow of death, where the workers of iniquity may hide themselves.

23 For he will not lay upon man more than right; that he should enter into judgment with God.

24 He shall break in pieces mighty men without number, and set others in their stead.

25 Therefore he knoweth their works, and he overturneth them in the night, so that they are destroyed.

26 He striketh them as wicked men in the open sight of others;

27 Because they turned back from him, and would not consider any of his ways:

28 So that they cause the cry of the poor to come unto him, and he heareth the cry of the afflicted.

29 When he giveth quietness, who then can make trouble? and when he hideth his face, who then can behold him? whether it be done against a nation, or against a man only:

30 That the hypocrite reign not, lest the people be ensnared.

31 Surely it is meet to be said unto God, I have borne chastisement, I will not offend any more:

32 That which I see not teach thou me: if I have done iniquity, I will do no more.

33 Should it be according to thy mind? he will recompense it, whether thou refuse, or whether thou choose; and not I: therefore speak what thou knowest.

34 Let men of understanding tell me, and let a wise man hearken unto me.

35 Job hath spoken without knowledge, and his words were without wisdom.

36 My desire is that Job may be tried unto the end because of his answers for wicked men.

37 For he addeth rebellion unto his sin, he clappeth his hands among us, and multiplieth his words against God.


Isaiah 55:8-9 (KJV)

8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.

9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.

[notofworks]

Originally Posted by Falla39

Job 34:21-37 (KJV)

21 For his eyes are upon the ways of man, and he seeth all his goings.

22 There is no darkness, nor shadow of death, where the workers of iniquity may hide themselves.

23 For he will not lay upon man more than right; that he should enter into judgment with God.

24 He shall break in pieces mighty men without number, and set others in their stead.

25 Therefore he knoweth their works, and he overturneth them in the night, so that they are destroyed.

26 He striketh them as wicked men in the open sight of others;

27 Because they turned back from him, and would not consider any of his ways:

28 So that they cause the cry of the poor to come unto him, and he heareth the cry of the afflicted.

29 When he giveth quietness, who then can make trouble? and when he hideth his face, who then can behold him? whether it be done against a nation, or against a man only:

30 That the hypocrite reign not, lest the people be ensnared.

31 Surely it is meet to be said unto God, I have borne chastisement, I will not offend any more:

32 That which I see not teach thou me: if I have done iniquity, I will do no more.

33 Should it be according to thy mind? he will recompense it, whether thou refuse, or whether thou choose; and not I: therefore speak what thou knowest.

34 Let men of understanding tell me, and let a wise man hearken unto me.

35 Job hath spoken without knowledge, and his words were without wisdom.

36 My desire is that Job may be tried unto the end because of his answers for wicked men.

37 For he addeth rebellion unto his sin, he clappeth his hands among us, and multiplieth his words against God.


Isaiah 55:8-9 (KJV)

8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.

9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.

I know you mean well with this, but it really doesn't help make sense in the discussion that's taking place.

First, Elihu was speaking about what he thought should happen to Job and we clearly see in the final chapters of this book, that it didn't happen. In effect, he was saying, "This is what Job deserves, but God isn't like that."

Second, this passage from Isaiah is one of, if not the most, misapplied passages in the bible. Before Isaiah spoke the words you posted above, he spoke of the people on which God would show His mercy. Some believe this was a reference to the Gentiles, that God would unload His grace on whomever he liked.....and Isaiah followed that statement with the famous, "For my ways are not your ways......" etc. In other words, "I'll save whoever I want to save." Isaiah was NOT trying to explain all the operations of God and His sovereignty. He wasn't saying, "God does what He wants, don't question it."

I believe it's lazy exegesis to throw, "God's thoughts aren't yours" in an attempt to apply reason to something that is unreasonable.

[Flutecrafter]

Originally Posted by nahkoe

I allow for yet another option, that for some reason I don't understand, bad stuff happens and somehow, God really is involved with humankind, but I haven't been able to figure out how He can be all powerful (as claimed), *and* involved with humankind, *and* bad stuff still happens.

And that, sista, is the question that we may not actually get answered
until we see Jesus face to face.
I've seen His power....
I've been seen His involvment, in my life and in others...
I've seen 'bad stuff' that still gives me nightmares at times...

And I am fairly certain that you could have typed this post.
(with better grammar of course)
We can either spend our efforts trying to figure out the ~how~ or we can
walk away, or we can get to know Jesus better and trust that He knows
what He's doing.
Or we can do what I have done in the past: allow spiritual paralysis to set in
and neutralize us. Thusly making us easy targets for the 'bad stuff' as well.
That's not a grand slam for the adversary (like walking away would be),
but he'll take it ifn he can get it.

[nahkoe]

Originally Posted by Flutecrafter

And that, sista, is the question that we may not actually get answered
until we see Jesus face to face.
I've seen His power....
I've been seen His involvment, in my life and in others...
I've seen 'bad stuff' that still gives me nightmares at times...

And I am fairly certain that you could have typed this post.
(with better grammar of course)

I could have typed this. I have seen power, presumably His. I have seen His involvement in my life and in others. And I've definitely seen things that still give me nightmares.

Originally Posted by Flutecrafter

We can either spend our efforts trying to figure out the ~how~ or we can
walk away, or we can get to know Jesus better and trust that He knows
what He's doing.
Or we can do what I have done in the past: allow spiritual paralysis to set in
and neutralize us. Thusly making us easy targets for the 'bad stuff' as well.
That's not a grand slam for the adversary (like walking away would be),
but he'll take it ifn he can get it.

I think I'm probably sitting here quite paralyzed. Maybe trying to figure out the ~how~ is an attempt to avoid becoming completely paralyzed.