Needing advice

[Hisdaughter]

Hi, Im new to the group. I have a question for people in the UPC.

My husband and I are 41 we have 3 children, one grown.

We have been praying and seeking God for quite a few years about finding a new church home. And we visit other churches that dont interfere with our own church services and we like the preaching, but never had it in our hearts that we were to make a new church our home.

None of the churches we visited in our area have been UPC. Just pentecostal.

The church we are in now is listed in the UPC website, but I dont think our pastor is anylonger with UPC.

We do not fellowship with other churches. Our youth are isolated. (the few youth that we have). Many have left our church. There are a handful of families left in attendence.

We were blessed when we came to this church and led by God to do so. We were new christians looking for a church family, the Lord had called us to homeschool our children, we knew no other homeschoolers.

When we found this church, we knew it was it. And later found out most kids in the small church were homeschooled. So the Lord really had us there and we were blessed by meeting other homeschool families that helped lead us and guide us in many areas.

AS we started visiting other UPC and spirit filled churches we noticed that things went on in those churches that we didnt have at our church. WE also noticed that our church didnt grow (weve been there for 7 years). Many have left our church. And are in the process of leaving. Some are going to Calvary chapel type churches. We dont want to do that.

If we go to conventions or the like, Pastor doesnt really like it. He has told me that what we see and recieve at those places, I will see at our church. Iv waited many years and havent seen it. I dont see the gifts of the Spirit in action.

I dont want to be criticle and I know that there are problems in all churches and I dont want to talk bad about our church. But we are very concerned.

Is it normal to be at a church for 7 years and never see anyone recieve the Holy Ghost for the first time? Is this normal?

The leadership is governing Gods spirit, (or trying to) and may not know it. When Gods spirit begins to move, they control it by starting to preach or telling people to sit down, now stand, now sit, now hold hands, not do this ect.

I may sound silly, because these are normal things to ask a congregation to do, but its the timing. Its like God is interupped by Man.

My son is 16, he is a good kid. He doesnt get into trouble, HEs a servant, obedient and respectful. He recieved the HOly Ghost at home during worship. And so did my youngest. My oldest recieved at Revival Tabernacle in San Diego, when we went there for a visit. Its too far to make our church home.

the kids in our church all leave at 18, and they marry others that are not baptized or spirit filled. I believe it has alot to do with our church being isolated, they have no other like believers to meet.

We had been referred to another church. We really like it. My son has been involved with thier youth group during this past month and he loves it. I love the preaching by the pastor and my daughter (10 yrs) liked her sunday school class, we all liked it and this is rare, we are considering making it our church home.

We are praying and fasting more before deciding. But since this is our first church we have no idea about the correct way to go about leaving a church. Both churches are UPC.

An odd thing has happed this year, a loved brother from our church is in the process of a divorce and happens to be going to this church. So my pastor has been in contact with this new pastor. Which makes it a little bit of an inconvenient time. Im thinking maybe the new pastor wont want us to come to his church which will break my sons heart. He is loving the youth there.

We havent actually discussed any of this with either pastors. And arent sure which to speak to first. Our first thought was our pastor for 7 years. Though he will not approve of us leaving. He will think we are in the wrong, because we left his church. Though my husband will let him know we are leaving and talk to him.

But I have this concern that this new pastor may not want us to join his church, because of the uncomfortablness with the brother that has divorced and moved over there ( though we get along just fine with this brother, but in no way want to make him uncomfortable).

And also I know my Pastor of 7 years will call the new pastor and possibly make it hard for us to switch churches.

This fear, guilt and condemnation I feel could be from the enemy. I feel guilty for leaving this church. There is a proud and arrogant spirit going through the leadership in this 7 year church and has been there for a LONG time. We have no outreach. The core of the church has been there for over 20 years. We have some military families that come and go.

We reach out on our own, but when we bring people to our church, they dont feel very welcomed. Its wierd.

When we went to this other church my son was welcomed right away. They have hearts to reach out, so do we adn would love to be in a church with the same mind.

What is the correct way to switch from one UPC church to another. They are in nearby cities.

This new UPC church (well new to us) we have been visiting. The youth get together with other UPC youth, its great. I love it. I want to be able to have womens retreats or conventions, I love that. We dont have that were we are.

But please let me know, is it normal that no one ever gets filled with the Holy Ghost?

I was there 6 years and never saw it happen. Then last year a young 19 year old girl started leading our youth in worship, and invited them to the church when no other leadership was there. And she led them in worship and prayer, the Spirit of God began to move strongly, it was awesom, it would go on for hours. The teens moved in the gifts of the Spirit, Gods spirit moved from that backroom into nearby rooms where younger siblings were and the younger siblings were filled with the HOly Ghost. This happend because there was no leadership there to govern and control gods spirit.

She wasnt encourged by leadership. They never showed any joy about what was going on with our youth. In fact they complained that there was not enough structure. They said there needs to be some control.

It breaks my heart, she resigned. They put up a new youth leader. She is in close with the pastor, because they pick a limited few a handful at the most of people and when they are picked they become so arrogant. It feels like there is no love, just pride, So she raves about herself and the good job she is doing with the youth.

She gives them a message and then icecream. These teens are so bored. They want the meat, they want to worship, they love to be in his presence. but now thier youth services are just like our sunday services.

When I ask any questions, I very humbly ask about the times of certain meetings or gatherings and I am treated like I have no right to ask her any questions. She says she is a youth leader, not a parent leader.

My son, wants our, I want him out. And I know from past experience that if anyone talks to pastor about the problems, he will not confront the person, he does not like to confront leadership. Maybe hes afraid of losing them or upsetting them.

The leadership teen daughter would go up in choir every sunday with thier lowcut shirts, see through shirts, very immodest and pastor would send out letters to all choir members stating the dress code but not talk to the two leadership families that were the only ones dressing like this. They held meetings spoke to everyone, but never to the two leadership families that allowed thier children to go up and sing with them in the choir like this. The families never took heed to the meetings or the letters. This went on for at least 2 years. It was a huge distraction. Not only was the imodesty a distraction but the rebellion.

The pastor would not confront them. But the pastors wife would make comments after church about the girls dress. And let her know it was a distraction. She said she was more concerned for the men and young men in our church. Yet she obviously wasnt concerned enough to speak to them about it. It went on another year.

Finally, my son 14 or 15 at the age asked the Father of the one that was leading this rebellion and dress if he could please talk to my son after church, my husband went in the office as well, didnt speak but was there because we felt if our son did not have a parent there, that a proud and arrogant spirit may be at work and would not like the confrontation, But with my husband there, it would be controlled.

My son kindly respectfully and humbly let the father know that when he is out on the streets, he tries not to stare at girls that dress immodest. He tries to gaurd his eyes. And he can understand that new people come to the church and dress immodest,, but up in front during half the service adn from leadership children, he feels church should be a safe place.

Since then the dress has changed. No more immodesty. Thank God.

But we were now thought of to be criticle and judging.

Im wondering are we over criticle? ARe we expecting too much? are we over reacting?

And how can we relate this to the new pastor if asked why we are leaving. We dont want to go to a new church compaining about our old one. He will worry that we are going to complain about his church.

The Lord led us to this church. But it seems it was for a long season. We are not fed. No growth. No outreach. Please help with any advise. But we do want to stay in a Jesus name Spirit filled church. And we want to be in the organization, so that we wont be isolated. My kids need that.

Sorry so lengthy.

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