Can church be bad for your health? - Page 14

nahkoe · #**131** 11-08-2010, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ILG

Why not address real PTSD in church people rather than making fun of people who get their nose out of joint.

But isn't it obvious!? People don't really get hurt in churches by Christians. Churchy people are perfect. If anyone gets all upset, it's obviously just an overreaction on their part and a perfect misunderstanding.

Aquila · #**132** 11-09-2010, 07:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ILG

I suppose someone could have PTSD if, say, they were in a church that coerced them to marry, cast devils out of them all the time, turned people and family members against each other or something like that.

Amen. I've seen it and experienced it.

Aquila · #**133** 11-09-2010, 07:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pelathais

Sounds like you're the one "whining" here.

This refrain is the usual spiel from those that abuse others. After unloading their load of manure on their audience, they then demean any protest with the "No Whining" appeal.

A legitimate complaint against unchristian behavior is NOT "whining." It is one form of "rebuke" (1 Timothy 5:19-20).

So, to all of the pastors and preachers out there... QUIT WHINING! You are the instigator in this problem. It behooves you to find ways to cope with the complaints that your "ministry" instigates. It's time for you to be the "grown up." Grow up.

Our biggest problem has always been untrained or badly trained clergy.

Aquila · #**134** 11-09-2010, 07:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coadie

Is there anything more tramatic than someone else being chosen to be the organist?

Coadie, we're not talking about the silly stuff. We're talking about emotional, spiritual, and mental abuse. I listed examples of what many consider spiritual abuse.

Aquila · #**135** 11-09-2010, 07:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pelathais

I don't really know or understand all of the details of your situation, nahkoe, but I for one really do think that it is at least possible for someone to get to get something that is at least similar to PTS from church conflicts.

One time I had a lady so mad at me that she hollered at me until she could no longer stand on her own. She was subsequently hospitalized. This was because I "walked away from her." Seriously. I didn't want to stand there and argue and she literally burnt out a fuse when I walked away.

There was another time when I was "interviewed" by a local Police Captain with "Federal agents" popping in and out because of something a pastor I was associated with had said publicly. I could go on, and it does get rather nasty... but that's not particularly helpful.

We demand a deep emotional commitment from the people who participate in our services. We should not be surprised when we see deep emotional responses to what's going on. My own biggest PTS type shock came when I discovered that this whole "church thing" is really just a game many of our leaders play to secure their incomes.

I actually believed all this stuff at one time ("anointed ministry" and all of that). It took some pretty good shocks to change my mind.

So true.

Aquila · #**136** 11-09-2010, 07:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nahkoe

But isn't it obvious!? People don't really get hurt in churches by Christians. Churchy people are perfect. If anyone gets all upset, it's obviously just an overreaction on their part and a perfect misunderstanding.

Great point. I've noticed that abusive religion will typically blame the victim. The issue is that a leader must realize, it doens't matter who's right or wrong... the party who experienced or perceives to have experienced a serious wrong is living a reality. A wise pastor once told me, "Chris, perception is reality. It's real to them. You have to start there." I think a lot of abuse and hurt is perpetuated with the "Get over it.", or the, "Maybe if YOU weren't so sensitive.", or, "You're not in the Spirit.", kind of arguments. Even if a person wasn't truly wronged, they perceive it. You have to address that and mediate the problem for all parties invovled.

ILG · #**137** 11-09-2010, 08:23 AM

I was talking to someone about old church issues the other day and I still feel guilty for talking about it. It gets so drilled in that it's wrong to talk about (especially by people who deny there are any issues and call hurting people whiners) that I know it will be a huge milestone for me when I can talk about these issues without feeling like I am doing something wrong. My head totally knows that there is nothing wrong with it, but my emotions don't get it quite yet.

nahkoe · #**138** 11-09-2010, 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aquila

Great point. I've noticed that abusive religion will typically blame the victim. The issue is that a leader must realize, it doens't matter who's right or wrong... the party who experienced or perceives to have experienced a serious wrong is living a reality. A wise pastor once told me, "Chris, perception is reality. It's real to them. You have to start there." I think a lot of abuse and hurt is perpetuated with the "Get over it.", or the, "Maybe if YOU weren't so sensitive.", or, "You're not in the Spirit.", kind of arguments. Even if a person wasn't truly wronged, they perceive it. You have to address that and mediate the problem for all parties invovled.

Exactly. Perception is reality. Even when I allow for the fact that my perception isn't the whole story, and I really am rational enough to allow for that and unintentional misunderstandings, I have still been hurt. Nothing is going to change that, and I'm left to deal with the feelings and consequences.

nahkoe · #**139** 11-09-2010, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ILG

I was talking to someone about old church issues the other day and I still feel guilty for talking about it. It gets so drilled in that it's wrong to talk about (especially by people who deny there are any issues and call hurting people whiners) that I know it will be a huge milestone for me when I can talk about these issues without feeling like I am doing something wrong. My head totally knows that there is nothing wrong with it, but my emotions don't get it quite yet.

I get this.

ILG · #**140** 11-09-2010, 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nahkoe

Exactly. Perception is reality. Even when I allow for the fact that my perception isn't the whole story, and I really am rational enough to allow for that and unintentional misunderstandings, I have still been hurt. Nothing is going to change that, and I'm left to deal with the feelings and consequences.

The people who blame the victim and say people who talk are whiners are a roadblock to healing that must be overcome in addition to the original pain.