What is the purpose of Hell?

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by *AQuietPlace*

Salvation from what? If there's no hell.

Oh, there is a Hell. The question is... what is Hell's purpose? Punishment, burning, retribution, suffering,... though it ends in the ages to come. What individual would want to burn for over a thousand years? Saving people from the wrath of God is very important.

But most importantly... salvation is that we might have life and have it more abundantly. We can live a blessed life of joy and blessing. Peace and assurance of a life of true happiness. Saved from the consequences of living a sinful life. Saved from shame for having wasted our lives on our selves and our selfish pursuits. Saved from being alone in the world to have a relationship with a loving God.

I question those who are living for God merely because of Hell. If a person cannot live for God without the threat of Hell... is their conversion real? If I took a person up to the altar at gun point they might dance... but it's not true praise.

Salvation is mentioned throughout the Bible in ways that are related to temporal deliverance.

Saved.

[*AQuietPlace*]

See, I don't get saying that God "is not that cruel, etc. etc." and then saying that someone might burn for a thousand years. Anything over a few minutes would be cruel and unusual punishment, no?

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by *AQuietPlace*

See, I don't get saying that God "is not that cruel, etc. etc." and then saying that someone might burn for a thousand years. Anything over a few minutes would be cruel and unusual punishment, no?

But what does it say about God? Compare. A punishment that refines the soul in the future ages compared to eternal, unending torments. The punishment is fearsome and terrible... but in Universalism it serves a purpose.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by *AQuietPlace*

See, I don't get saying that God "is not that cruel, etc. etc." and then saying that someone might burn for a thousand years. Anything over a few minutes would be cruel and unusual punishment, no?

You see... this appears to be a knee jerk reaction. People think that God has to be a God that torments forever or milk toast not punishing at all. Universalism sees a third way in Scripture. A fearsome God worthy of fear and who will indeed fearsomely judge and punish for sin... but who is also infinitely loving and totally victorious over sin and Satan.

God is fearsome and terrible. We should indeed fear him. But we need not propose that God will torment people forever to demonstrate this.

[DerechHashem]

1 Pet 4:1 Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;
1 Pet 4:2 That he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh to the lusts of men, but to the will of God.
1 Pet 4:3 For the time past of our life may suffice us to have wrought the will of the Gentiles, when we walked in lasciviousness, lusts, excess of wine, revellings, banquetings, and abominable idolatries:
1 Pet 4:4 Wherein they think it strange that ye run riot, speaking evil of you:
1 Pet 4:5 Who shall give account to him that is ready to judge the quick and the dead.
1 Pet 4:6 For this cause was the gospel preached also to them that are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit.

This does not speak of preaching to dead people in the grave in the physical sense.

In context it is speaking of preaching to the Gentiles, the unbelievers, the spiritually dead, that they too might hear and believe the Gospel message.

Another example of this is found in the book of John:

John 5:25 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.

At the time, Jesus was speaking of those people hearing His voice at that instant.

Those that were spiritually dead in the crowd that heard and believed Him, would inherit eternal life.

This is exactly what 1 Peter 4:6 is saying as well.

Until the resurrection, however, those in the grave hear nothing and do nothing:

Eccl 9:5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.

Eccl 9:10 Whatsover thy hand findeth to do, do it with thy might; for there is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the grave, whither thou goest.

The time is indeed coming, however, when Jesus will speak to those dead in their graves:

John 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
John 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

[DerechHashem]

1 Pet 3:18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:
1 Pet 3:19 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;
1 Pet 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

Verse 18 contains a parallelism, the same thought expressed twice.

1 Pet 3:18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, ...

Jesus Christ who was sinless, died once on the cross for sinners, and was resurrected to reconcile sinners with God, ...

... being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:

He died the death all we mortals must die, but He was raised to life by the Holy Spirit.

The parallelism above states twice that Christ died and was resurrected.

1 Pet 3:19 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison; [The word translated preached G2784. kerusso, is also properly translated as proclaim. See Rev 5:2 So it does not necessarily refer to preaching the gospel.]

Verse 19 says that in His resurrected state (By which), Christ went and proclaimed his victory over the spirits in prison.

So who are these spirits?

Verse 22 parallels and restates verse 19:

1 Pet 3:22 Who is gone into heaven, and is on the right hand of God; angels and authorities and powers being made subject unto him.

The spirits in prison refers not to people, but fallen angels and authorities and powers who are also spoken of as being chained:

Eph 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

Col 2:15 And [by His resurrection] having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a show of them openly, triumphing over them [fallen angels] in it.

Rev 20:1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
Rev 20:2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
Rev 20:3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
...
Rev 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

Jude 1:6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.

2 Pet 2:4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;

1 Peter 3:20 and 21 speak of Noah's experience with the flood, and Christ's death and resurrection, as types of baptism, in which the sinner can gain, and proclaim, victory over sin and death:

1 Pet 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.
1 Pet 3:21 The like figure [of death and resurrection] whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:

Rom 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

So properly understood, this passage of 1 Peter 3:18-20 does not teach that Jesus preached to spirits of dead people in Hell or purgatory after His death on the cross, it simply does not validate a belief in an intermediate "prison" or limbo for immortal souls between death and heaven, as some teach today.

When Christ died on the cross, He was buried, and did nothing until His resurrection.

He went nowhere and preached to no one during the time period between His crucifixion and resurrection.

Dead is dead.

[Aquila]

Derech, did Jesus die to save the world?

[DerechHashem]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Derech, did Jesus die to save the world?

Yup to all that may seek him, just like John 3:16 states, but notice their are two options.

Life and death.

[DerechHashem]

"Sheol". Hebrew, Sheõl.

This Is Appendix 35 From The Companion Bible.

The first occurrence of this word is in Genesis 37:35, where it is rendered "grave". It occurs sixty-five times in the Hebrew of the Old Testament; and only by studying each passage by itself can the student hope to gather the Biblical usage of the word. All heathen or traditional usages are not only worthless, but mischievous. The following are all the passages where the word "Sheol" occurs, with the rendering in each passage indicated thus:


1. = grave, 2. = pit, 3. = hell.


1. Genesis 37:35.
1. Genesis 42:38.
1 Genesis 44:29,31.
2. Numbers 16:30,33.
3. Deuteronomy 32:22.
1. 1Samuel 2:6.
3. 2Samuel 22:6.
1. 1Kings 2:6,9.
1. Job 7:9.
3. Job 11:8.
1. Job 14:13.
1. Job 17:13.
2. Job 17:16.
1. Job 21:13.
1. Job 24:19.
3. Job 26:6.
1. Psalm 6:5.
3. Psalm 9:17.
3. Psalm 16:10.
3. Psalm 18:5.
1. Psalm 30:3.
1. Psalm 31:17.
1. Psalm 49:14,14,15.
3. Psalm 55:15. (margin grave).
3. Psalm 86:13. (margin grave).
3. Psalm 88:3.
1. Psalm 89:48.
3. Psalm 116:3.
3. Psalm 139:8.
1. Psalm 141:7.
1. Proverbs 1:12.
3. Proverbs 5:5.
3. Proverbs 7:27.
3. Proverbs 9:18.
3. Proverbs 15:11,24.
3. Proverbs 23:14.
3. Proverbs 27:20.
1. Proverbs 30:16.
1. Ecclesiastes 9:10.
1. Song of Solomon 8:6.
3. Isaiah 5:14.
3. Isaiah 14:9 (margin grave).
1. Isaiah 14:11.
3. Isaiah 14:15.
3. Isaiah 28:15,18.
1. Isaiah 38:10.
1. Isaiah 38:18.
3. Isaiah 57:9.
1. Ezekiel 31:15.
3. Ezekiel 31:16,17.
3. Ezekiel 32:21,27.
1. Hosea 13:14,14.
3. Amos 9:2.
3. Jonah 2:2 (margin grave).
3. Habakkuk 2:5.

As meaning "THE grave," it is to be distinguished from keber, A grave, or burying-place (from kabar, to bury, first occurrence Genesis 23:4): and bõr, a pit, generally hewn in the rock, hence used of a cistern (Genesis 37:20) or a dugeon, and etc., when dry. (See note below on the word "well" in Genesis 21:19.)


Note on Genesis 21:19.

[DerechHashem]

The Synonymous Words for "Hell", etc.

This Is Appendix 131 From The Companion Bible.

"Hell" is the English rendering of two different Greek words in the New Testament

The English word is from the Anglo-Saxon hel, Genitive case helle = a hidden place, from the Anglo-Saxon helan = to hide.

It is in the New Testament used as the translation of two Greek words :-

Gehenna. Greek geenna. This is the transliteration of the Hebrew Gai' Hinnom, that is to say the Valley of Hinnom or "the Valley" of [the sons of] Hinnom, where were the fires through which children were passed in the worship of Moloch.

In the Old Testament Tophet was the Hebrew word used, because it was a place in this valley.

In our Lord's day the idolatry had ceased, but the fires were still continually burning there for the destruction of the refuse of Jerusalem. Hence, geenna was used for the fires of destruction associated with the judgment of God. Sometimes, "geenna of fire". See 2Kings 23:10. Isaiah 30:33. Jeremiah 7:31, 32; 19:11-14.

Geenna occurs 12 times, and is always rendered "hell", videlicet Matthew 5:22, 29, 30; 10:28; 18:9; 23:15, 33. Mark 9:43, 45, 47. Luke 12:5. James 3:6.


Hades. Greek hades, from a (privative) and idein, to see (Appendix 133. I. i); used by the Greeks for the unseen world.

The meaning which the Greeks put upon it does not concern us; nor have we anything to do with the imaginations of the heathen, or the traditions of Jews or Romanists, or the teachings of demons or evil spirits, or of any who still cling to them.

The Holy Spirit has used it as one of the "words pertaining to the earth", and in so doing has "purified" it, "as silver tried in a furnace" (see notes on Psalms 12:6). From this we learn that His own words "are pure", but words belonging to this earth have to be "purified".

The Old Testament is the fountain head of the Hebrew language. It has no literature behind it. But the case is entirely different with the Greek language. The Hebrew Sheol is a word Divine in its origin and usage. The Greek Hades is human in its origin and comes down to us laden with centuries of development, in which it has acquired new senses, meanings, and usages.

Seeing that the Holy Spirit has used it in Acts 2:27, 31 as His own equivalent of Sheol in Psalm 16:10, He has settled, once for all, the sense in which we are to understand it. The meaning He has given to Sheol in Psalms 16:10 is the one meaning we are to give it wherever it occurs in the New Testament, whether we transliterate it or translate it. We have no liberty to do otherwise, and must discard everything outside the Word of God.

The word occurs eleven times (Matthew 11:23; 16:18. Luke 10:15; 16:23. Acts 2:27, 31. 1Corinthians 15:55. Revelation 1:18; 6:8; 20:13, 14); and is rendered "hell" in every passage except one, where it is rendered "grave" (1Corinthians 15:55, margin "hell").

In the Revised Version the word is always transliterated "Hades", except in 1Corinthians 15:55 (where "death" is substituted because of the reading, in all the texts, of thanate for hade), and in the American Revised Version also.

As Hades is the Divine Scriptural equivalent of Sheol, further light may be gained from Appendix 35, and a reference to the 65 passages there given. It may be well to note that while "Hades" is rendered "hell" in the New Testament (except once, where the rendering "the grave" could not be avoided), Sheol, its Hebrew equivalent, occurs 65 times, and is rendered "the grave" 31 times (or 54%); "hell" 31 times (4 times with margin "the grave", reducing it to 41.5%); and "pit" only 3 times (or 4.5 %).

"The grave", therefore, is obviously the best rendering, meaning the state of death (German sterbend, for which we have no English equivalent); not the act of dying, as an examination of all the occurrences of both words will show.

The rendering "pit" so evidently means "the grave" that it may at once be substituted for it (Numbers 16:30, 33. Job 17:16).

The rendering "the grave" (not "a grave", which is Hebrew keber or bor) exactly expresses the meaning of both Sheol and Hades. For, as to direction, it is always down: as to place, it is in the earth: as to relation, it is always in contrast with the state of the living (Deuteronomy 32:22-25 and 1Samuel 2:6-8); as to association, it is connected with mourning (Genesis 37:34, 35), sorrow (Genesis 42:38. 2Samuel 22:6. Psalms 18:5; 116:3), fright and terror (Numbers 16:27, 34), mourning (Isaiah 38:3, 10, 17, 18), silence (Psalms 6:5; 31:17. Ecclesiastes 9:10), no knowledge (Ecclesiastes 9:5, 6, 10), punishment (Numbers 16:29, 34. 1Kings 2:6, 9. Job 24:19. Psalms 9:17 (Revised Version = re-turned)), corruption (Psalms 16:10. Acts 2:27, 31); as to duration, resurrection is the only exit from it (Psalms 16:11. Acts 2:27, 31; 13:33-37. 1Corinthians 15:55. Revelation 1:18; 20:5, 13, 14).

Tartaroo (occurs only in 2Peter 2:4) = to thrust down to Tartarus, Tartarus being a Greek word, not used elsewhere, or at all in the Septuagint. Homer describes it as subterranean (compare Deuteronomy 32:22, which may refer to this). The Homeric Tartarus is the prison of the Titans, or giants (compare Hebrew Rephaim, Appendix 25), who rebelled against Zeus.

http://www.therain.org/appendixes/app131.html