Is Oneness Modalism ?

[Scott Hutchinson]

Alot of people in the church world call Oneness Pentecostals , Modalists.
But I understand the Oneness doctrine does necessarily mean Modalism.
So is the doctrine of the Oneness of God modalistic ?

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Scott Hutchinson

Alot of people in the church world call Oneness Pentecostals , Modalists.
But I understand the Oneness doctrine does necessarily mean Modalism.
So is the doctrine of the Oneness of God modalistic ?

It's probably a form of modalism, just as you might find trinitarians that have a form of Trinitarianism..

In fact Modalism was called a Trinitarian heresy.

I would say there are very close similarities

[Scott Hutchinson]

Someone said once that if you believe God exists as Father,Son,Holy Ghost you weren't a Modalist ,became Modalism teaches that God became Father,Son,Holy Ghost like actors putting on and taking off masks.

[Scott Hutchinson]

Maybe I can find that link mentioned this.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Scott Hutchinson

Someone said once that if you believe God exists as Father,Son,Holy Ghost you weren't a Modalist ,became Modalism teaches that God became Father,Son,Holy Ghost like actors putting on and taking off masks.

I think you are referring to successive modalism which taught the Father changed into the Son and was ONLY the Son then he changed into the Holy Ghost and is now ONLY the Holy Ghost

[Scott Hutchinson]

PRAX here check out this articles of faith from this church.
http://christtemplemuncie.org/articles.html

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by Scott Hutchinson

Alot of people in the church world call Oneness Pentecostals , Modalists.
But I understand the Oneness doctrine does necessarily mean Modalism.
So is the doctrine of the Oneness of God modalistic ?

The thing about the Oneness Pentecostal movement of today is that it is definitely not a monolithic movement. No one can honestly say that we move in lock-step with one another. So it's very difficult to say that OP's are... (fill in the blank).

Some OP's probably are, many are not. Most will quibble and argue the terminology until both sides forget what the point of the original argument was. I know when I put it that way, it sounds bad... but I actually think it's healthy.

We shy away from creedal formulas and don't want to get caught up in having a lot of boilerplate terminology that we have to be pinned down to. When you consider that we are trying to define "the Infinite" here, it's probably good to be as flexible in your language as you can reasonably be.

[Barb]

I should leave this discussion to the brethren, but since it's early in the thread, I'll jump in.

This is from The Godhead Discussion by Jerry Hayes...p. 1... Modalistic Monarchianism Defined...if his views are not yours or if his facts are not accurate, please do not crucify the messenger. The paragraphing is altered by me to accomodate forum reading...


The word monarch is taken from two words; mono, meaning one; and arch, meaning ruler. Thus in religion a monarchian is one who believes in one Supreme Being.

The term modal which is the root of the word modalist or modalistic, simply means: mode.

When expressing the Oneness view of God one might say that they hold a monarchian view. This would tell us that they believed God was one only Being, but in the Christian faith there is the existence of Father, Son, and Holy spirit. How can we maintain the monarchian view of God presented in the Old Testament, and at the same time embrace the New Testament teaching of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit?

Enter the word modal. (From the word mode: a particular form or variety of something; a form or manner of expression; a manifestation, form, or arrangement of being; a particular form or manifestation of an underlying substance. Modal: of or relating to structure as opposed to substance).

Therefore, we say that God is one only 'hypostasis' (substance or Being), which is manifested in creation in different modes, without altering His 'hypostasis' (substance or Being).

Thus God exists modally as the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit: with each mode being 'homoousios': of the same substance,essence, individual.

[Scott Hutchinson]

See Sister Barb yes I agree God is only being but plural in attributes.
I can't see the eternal sonship doctrine that Trinitarian folks teach.
But God is alot of things, Saviour ,Healer ,Paraclete, Baptizing Counselor etc,etc many things but Yet One Lord Jesus Christ.

[mfblume]

Modalism is Oneness. MODES of God would be Father, son and Holy Ghost, rather than "persons" of God. But there is Monarchian Modalism and Dynamic Modalism. Dynamic Modalism is like Adoptionism. They teach Jesus did not pre-exist. So we would be more like Monarchianistic Modalism, which believes Jesus is the Father in flesh.