Do All Speak With Tongues?

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by acerrak

i recieved the gift of tounges as i sought after spiritual gifts, awhile after i had recieved the Holy Ghost.

I had fruits of the Spirit before i had gifts of the Spirit

How did you know that you received the gift of the Holy Spirit? The fruit of the Spirit takes time to produce.

[acerrak]

Originally Posted by mizpeh

The word, gift, in Ephesians 2:8 is dorea in the Greek not charisma. Paul is speaking of the "gift" of salvation not the "gift" of the Holy Spirit.

I disagree with your interpretation. My experience was that I spoke with tongues when I received the Holy Spirit and then I did not speak in tongues again for almost a year after that while I was in the throws of childbirth, and not again since then in almost 30 years. I've diligently sought after tongues with much prayer, fasting, and tears thinking that something was wrong with my walk with God. I can't speak in tongues if I wanted to and I won't fake it because the times I did speak with tongues, they flowed out of me without any effort or thought on my part. So why don't I speak with tongues, because I don't and never have had the gift of tongues. I had the initial evidence of tongues and then an odd one-off experience of tongues while going through labor pains.

eh i disagree i had the Spirit, produced fruit for God, He answered my prayers, changed my life my living.... All this was way before i ever spoke in tounges.
Jesus said you will know my disciples by their fruit, not by tounges
I understand there to be an initial evidence of tongues for everyone who receives the baptism of the Holy Spirit which is not the same as the gift of tongues. That is why I don't speak with tongues. (you need to study the bible says the gifts are irrevocable, you speak in tounges you will always have that Gift its bible)


I believe those who spoke with tongues when they initially received the gift of the Spirit went on to prophesy. Boldness is not a gift of the Spirit nor is it the same, imo, as "power" or dunamis (Greek). The only sign given to us by the writers of the NT of Spirit baptism is tongues.

its ok to disagree i stand on the bible, and not bad hermenuetics

also i do apologize i gave the wrong verse romans 6;23 for the wages of sin is death but the Gift of God is eternal life through Jesus

this word in greek is charisma

i also want to point out that the prophet joel mentioned nothing about tounges in his prophecy, and i want to add you will have to argue with mark 16:17 cause its clear these signs will follow, tounges is just one of those

[acerrak]

Originally Posted by mizpeh

How did you know that you received the gift of the Holy Spirit? The fruit of the Spirit takes time to produce.

o no it doesnt.. who told you that???

I stoped being a porn addict over night, my potty mouth dried up, and my self centered life changed over night.. didnt need alcohol etc etc.

Lol it was a huge and drastic change, infact i was empowered by God that i wanted to help the kingdom so i put a fleece out, (still no tounges) God answered, doors opened and next thing i know i was helping minister in a rescue mission..

even the baptist preacher at my work who i use to haze and harrass all the time, will tell when that boy Got saved He got saved... I didnt get know religion i got a relationship.

My wife when going to her check up with her phyciatrist even noticed a difference in her, she said what happened/..... My husband Found God

yes it was over night, and yes i budded quickly to say you cant show fruits and it takes time to develop is non sense

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by acerrak

its ok to disagree i stand on the bible, and not bad hermenuetics

also i do apologize i gave the wrong verse romans 6;23 for the wages of sin is death but the Gift of God is eternal life through Jesus

this word in greek is charisma

i also want to point out that the prophet joel mentioned nothing about tounges in his prophecy, and i want to add you will have to argue with mark 16:17 cause its clear these signs will follow, tounges is just one of those

Romans 6:23...the gift = eternal life (not the gift of the Holy Spirit). Paul directly states that the gift is eternal life. That's clear.

An argument from silence doesn't really lend you much support since Peter clearly recognized the events of Acts 2:1-4 as a fulfillment of Joel's prophecy and Peter goes on to recognize tongues as evidence of Spirit baptism in Acts 10 and Acts 11.

I rarely, if ever anymore, resort to Mark 16 for support of any doctrine although I do believe that the long ending of Mark is true. But if you want to go there, Mark is not saying that those 'signs' are the initial evidence of Spirit baptism. He is merely stating that these are signs that follow believers.

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by acerrak

o no it doesnt.. who told you that???

I stoped being a porn addict over night, my potty mouth dried up, and my self centered life changed over night.. didnt need alcohol etc etc.

Lol it was a huge and drastic change, infact i was empowered by God that i wanted to help the kingdom so i put a fleece out, (still no tounges) God answered, doors opened and next thing i know i was helping minister in a rescue mission..

even the baptist preacher at my work who i use to haze and harrass all the time, will tell when that boy Got saved He got saved... I didnt get know religion i got a relationship.

My wife when going to her check up with her phyciatrist even noticed a difference in her, she said what happened/..... My husband Found God

yes it was over night, and yes i budded quickly to say you cant show fruits and it takes time to develop is non sense

True repentance will change a person instantly. But repentance is not the same as being baptized with the Holy Spirit. After I repented, I stopped doing many of the things I used to do as well.

I really should add that repentance comes only by the grace and goodness of God. The Spirit of God working with us, drawing us, wooing us, brings about a changed life. That can all be done by God in our hearts without us being filled with his Spirit.

[acerrak]

Originally Posted by mizpeh

True repentance will change a person instantly. But repentance is not the same as being baptized with the Holy Spirit. After I repented, I stopped doing many of the things I used to do as well.

I really should add that repentance comes only by the grace and goodness of God. The Spirit of God working with us, drawing us, wooing us, brings about a changed life. That can all be done by God in our hearts without us being filled with his Spirit.

the angels in even rejoice over one soul repenting, I have been in pentacost growing up in a trinitian church before i came into the upci.

the fact that tounges is the only initial evidence doctrine was not preached through out history, it beagin in the late 1800's

Ok if you repented and changed in any way, then that was the Spirit that did the change, no man will ever do it in their carnal mind wil. its not gonna happen.

john 3:5 look at it closly the (S)pirit gives birth to your (s)pirit notice the one is capital one is not

Ok you cant even come to Jesus unless the Spirit draws you. I have seen many people baptized with the Spirit, and many react in many different ways, i have never seen a uniform way. some dance some shout some speak with tounges some faint, some run around. The Spirit falls in worship


second lets take scripture at its word, acts 2:38
if a person repents and gets baptized in the name of Jesus for the remission of their sins the bible delcares that they will recieve the Gift of the Holy Ghost

Now here is the question when people do the repenting and baptism part, why in so many cases is their no tongues that follow.... why do people keep going back to the alter time and time again praying for the Sprit....

Im gonna say if God doesnt give them the Gift of the Holy Spirit then wouldnt the bible be a liar? Or have we gotten to a point that you must experience something and if you dont you didnt get it.. yet the scripture said they will recieve it.

but i want you to show me in your bible that
1.you must speak in tongues to have the Spirit
2. show me every conversion in the book of acts, and explain to me why tounges is not mentions in every case ( if it was the only evidence then surely Luke should have pinned it)
3. also show me that tounges are the only evidence of the Spirit.
4. i want to see the exact scripture you must speak with tongues to be saved (cause this is what you have stated in a round about way)

even in joels prohpecy he never mentioned the word tongues, again why would paul state not all speak with tounges if he knew everyone who is baptized in the Spirit would speak with tongues.... thats a Icy Hot

[deacon blues]

Originally Posted by mizpeh

Isn't that what happened to the early church in the book of Acts? they had an experience that confirmed to them that they had been Spirit baptized.

Was the experience in order to confirm what happened or was it to be a sign to unbelievers (I Cor 12)? It appears to me that it was to get unbelievers to ask the question: "What does this mean?"

[deacon blues]

Originally Posted by Stephanas

The words of John in John 7:39 do make a difference between the experience of pre-Pentecost believers and post-Pentecost believers.

(John 7:37-39) In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink. 38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water. 39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)

How do you interpret John's words "the Holy Ghost was not yet given" in light of your assertion that Elizabeth and Zacharias' Spirit infilling is the same as the 120 at Pentecost?

Peter said in Acts 2 that what happened in the upper room was a fulfillment of Joel 2, that is that God would pour out His Spirit upon ALL flesh. God filled others with His Spirit before then, but only selectively. It wasn't a different Spirit. It was the same Spirit poured out upon all flesh in Acts 2.

What about the cases in Acts where it says they were filled but didn't speak in togues? I don't see consistency when being filled w the Holy Ghost what exactly happened.

[deacon blues]

Originally Posted by mizpeh

How did you know that you received the gift of the Holy Spirit? The fruit of the Spirit takes time to produce.

Says who? What Scriptures support the notion that the fruit of the Spirit take time? I've seen people who have never spoken in tongues bear the fruit of the $spirit. When you repent, a change occurs. I've seen people walk away from repentance who display love, joy, peace, etc immediately.

[deacon blues]

Originally Posted by mizpeh

True repentance will change a person instantly. But repentance is not the same as being baptized with the Holy Spirit. After I repented, I stopped doing many of the things I used to do as well.

I really should add that repentance comes only by the grace and goodness of God. The Spirit of God working with us, drawing us, wooing us, brings about a changed life. That can all be done by God in our hearts without us being filled with his Spirit.

So you do admit God dwells in a believer before they ever speak in tongues?