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06-30-2010, 09:10 PM
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Go Dodgers!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
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Re: Oneness Pentecostal Apologetics Conference
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffrey
Prax, are you saying there is 100% uniformity among scholars (especially scholars that are Trinitarian) on this verse? I'd be surprised. When you say "Trinitarians translate this as ..." it sounds like they are one person or group, when in reality "they" aren't monolithic at all.
They do or don't want the verse to support the Son's deity? Their decision for interpretation is based on that alone?
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Im saying There are Trinitarian scholars, like the ones I already quoted, that admit this verse can be translated quite differently.
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Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
- There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
- The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
- Every sinner must repent of their sins.
- That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
- That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
- The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
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06-30-2010, 09:11 PM
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Go Dodgers!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 45,787
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Re: Oneness Pentecostal Apologetics Conference
Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron1710
I have been on both sides of the fence and guess what 90% of the time the problem is with the Oneness people. Can anyone recall an instance where a local college of Trinitarians take over a Oneness service? Yet we hear about it from time to time in a bragging way from Oneness folks.
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We do? I never heard of such a thing, ever, not once.
__________________
Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
- There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
- The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
- Every sinner must repent of their sins.
- That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
- That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
- The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
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06-30-2010, 09:16 PM
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Cross-examine it!
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Orcutt, CA.
Posts: 6,736
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Re: Oneness Pentecostal Apologetics Conference
Quote:
Originally Posted by Praxeas
We do? I never heard of such a thing, ever, not once.
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Seriously? The most obvious and easiest to document would be in John Wolframs book many voices.
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"Beware lest you lose the substance by grasping at the shadow." ~Aesop
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06-30-2010, 09:27 PM
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Supercalifragilisticexpiali...
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 19,197
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Re: Oneness Pentecostal Apologetics Conference
rather than reading 80 pages, can someone tell me if the doctorate question of yesterday was resolved?
__________________
"It is inhumane, in my opinion, to force people who have a genuine medical need for coffee to wait in line behind people who apparently view it as some kind of recreational activity." Dave Barry 2005
I am a firm believer in the Old Paths
Articles on such subjects as "The New Birth," will be accepted, whether they teach that the new birth takes place before baptism in water and Spirit, or that the new birth consists of baptism of water and Spirit. - THE PENTECOSTAL HERALD Dec. 1945
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves
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06-30-2010, 09:35 PM
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God's Son
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 3,743
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Re: Oneness Pentecostal Apologetics Conference
I think the devil is having a good laugh. Instead of a preaching/teaching about the cross and the power of the Blood, we waste our time with something the Bible says it's trivial. (see James). Not one single person will be lost or saved based their conception of God.
I have found a greater number of trinitarians open to oneness people than the other way around. When I grew up preachers taught the trinitarians hated us and we should hate them. When I got to know some trinitarians, they were more than happy to accept my oneness beliefs. I was even more amazed at the number of trinitarians who baptize in Jesus Name. My "oneness" teaching implied a person understood Oneness theology if they were baptized in Jesus name. Experience shows me the opposite is true.
Sounds like this conference is a waste of heaven's resources.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Badejo
Exactly, if you want to see some trinitarians foaming at the mouth damning all oneness to burn in hell forever (liberals, UC's-doesn't matter) go to CARM forums and click on "oneness".
I'm all for mixed fellowship among people who seek God and seek to live godly, but there are many on the other side of the fence who would rather die before fellowshipping a oneness person.
It does get old when folks come on here attacking oneness people, which thinking trinitarians are some great peace makers. **NEWSFLASH- oneness people didn't leave the AoG, they were kicked out.
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A religious spirit allows people to tolerate hatred and anger under the guise of passion and holiness. Bill Johnson
Legalism has no pity on people. Legalism makes my opinion your burden, makes opinion your boundary, makes my opinion your obligation-Lucado
Some get spiritual because they see the light. Others because they feel the heat.Ray Wylie Hubbard
Definition of legalism- Damned if you do. Damned if you don't. TV
Last edited by tv1a; 06-30-2010 at 09:38 PM.
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06-30-2010, 10:04 PM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 10,745
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Re: Oneness Pentecostal Apologetics Conference
Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron1710
Seriously? The most obvious and easiest to document would be in John Wolframs book many voices.
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What are you talking about?
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His banner over me is LOVE....  My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?
To be a servant of God, it will cost us our total commitment to God, and God alone. His burden must be our burden... Sis Alvear
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06-30-2010, 10:07 PM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 10,745
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Re: Oneness Pentecostal Apologetics Conference
Quote:
Originally Posted by tv1a
I think the devil is having a good laugh. Instead of a preaching/teaching about the cross and the power of the Blood, we waste our time with something the Bible says it's trivial. (see James). Not one single person will be lost or saved based their conception of God.
I have found a greater number of trinitarians open to oneness people than the other way around. When I grew up preachers taught the trinitarians hated us and we should hate them. When I got to know some trinitarians, they were more than happy to accept my oneness beliefs. I was even more amazed at the number of trinitarians who baptize in Jesus Name. My "oneness" teaching implied a person understood Oneness theology if they were baptized in Jesus name. Experience shows me the opposite is true.
Sounds like this conference is a waste of heaven's resources.
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What Trinitarians are you talking to? I haven't met many who don't condemn me to hell for not believing in the Trinity.
__________________
His banner over me is LOVE.... My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?
To be a servant of God, it will cost us our total commitment to God, and God alone. His burden must be our burden... Sis Alvear
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06-30-2010, 10:11 PM
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My Family!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Collierville, TN
Posts: 31,786
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Re: Oneness Pentecostal Apologetics Conference
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoovie
rather than reading 80 pages, can someone tell me if the doctorate question of yesterday was resolved?
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Yep - looks like he doesn't have one.
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Master of Science in Applied Disgruntled Religious Theorist Wrangling
PhD in Petulant Tantrum Quelling
Dean of the School of Hard Knocks
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06-30-2010, 10:13 PM
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My Family!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Collierville, TN
Posts: 31,786
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Re: Oneness Pentecostal Apologetics Conference
Quote:
Originally Posted by JN Anderson
Pelathais, I re-examined my 1986 Symposium book and it only suggests "two honorary degrees" and does not actually list the names of the institution. I also listened to the mp3 of Jesse Williams, who introduced Treece, and he actually says the two honorary degrees come from PTS. Other than this I don't know. I don't plan on calling him either.
At any rate, please read this properly. I was not saying we can do a translation tomorrow night. As I have said, since the beginning, it may be a long time before we get to such a place. I would like to see a study bible as Baron mentioned. I think though the Oneness scholars should prepare for this, all the more since it does not happen overnight. I would also surmise that the process of translation would be open and nothing hidden. Just thoughts of times in the future.
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For Hoovie
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Master of Science in Applied Disgruntled Religious Theorist Wrangling
PhD in Petulant Tantrum Quelling
Dean of the School of Hard Knocks
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06-30-2010, 10:18 PM
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Ravaged by Grace
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Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 7,948
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Re: Oneness Pentecostal Apologetics Conference
Quote:
Originally Posted by mizpeh
What Trinitarians are you talking to? I haven't met many who don't condemn me to hell for not believing in the Trinity.
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Then evidently, the only trinitarian you've talked to is Hank Haanagraaf.
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