Let's Bash the Preacher Some More

[Rhoni]

Originally Posted by Scott Hutchinson

Perhaps if one would walk in a preacher's shoes just once perhaps they would be hestitant to bash a preacher.

Some have walked in their shoes and still bash because they met so many who were not worthy of honor. I have stories of Pastors and Pastor's wives that we fellwoshipped with and the things they felt at liberty to do and say just grieved my spirit. Of course when you call them on it then they think you are self-righteous and come up with a lie to discredit you.

People some days

[gloryseeker]

Originally Posted by tbpew

GS,
What I find interesting is your example has no bearing on the dynamic of the Kingdom of God. In some ways, this is coming around (once again) to applying authority when none exists --member to member within a body.

If God's dwellingplace was established in the manner of a hierarchial military, your example would be spot on ---but since God's abode is a body your example lacks application.

suppose we disagree then

[tbpew]

Originally Posted by gloryseeker

suppose we disagree then

seems like a solid supposition.

I'm going to keep on focusing on member to member interaction in a body and others can focus on what they think establishes the dynamic, even if it includes saluting rank.

[Jermyn Davidson]

Originally Posted by Michlow

Granted. However, a president is something that is necessary (or at least some sort of government leader), and I think most would agree. But not all will agree that a pastor is a necessity.

How could someone sincerely believe that a Pastor is not necessary? Didn't God establish is church WITH a form of government for His people?

[tbpew]

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

How could someone sincerely believe that a Pastor is not necessary? Didn't God establish is church WITH a form of government for His people?

JD,
what form of government did God design your own body with?
Are there multiple heads (main head and under-heads) throughout your body?

Do you believe that God really has a body that he inhabits (anoints) or it all just fun with metaphors?

Please don't get me wrong, when we function in the shared, common, temporal realm there will be a need for oversight and guides in service to equipping and orderly conduct among the diversity of the saints ----but lets not drag the necessary temporal management systems into surrogate headships pertaining to the Kingdom of God; a Kingdom which does not pertain to meat or drink, but rather is defined as righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Spirit.

[jaxfam6]

When some pull out the "I'm a man of God" card and expect others to 'respect' him just because he is ordained by an organization it is risky. There are many men and women that I respect that I am certain are called of God to do a work for Him. I would never speak ill of them, even with the ones I disagree with. There are several others that I know who are 'ordained' by men but are by no means CALLED by God, back to that "fruits that follow them" thing. Those folk are ones I may not speak of at all, or will, if provoked, give my opinion on.

[Fiyahstarter]

Originally Posted by jaamez

I need a pastor who is a true shepherd, lovingly leading. The shepherd doesn't actually feed the sheep, but rather leads the flock to a place where they can FEED THEMSELVES. That's the calling of the pastor, and is intended to compliment the other ministerial gifts/callings that are provided for the perfection of the saints.

I wanted this repeated, just a little louder!

[ManOfWord]

Originally Posted by Fiyahstarter

I wanted this repeated, just a little louder!

I need a pastor who is a true shepherd, lovingly leading. The shepherd doesn't actually feed the sheep, but rather leads the flock to a place where they can FEED THEMSELVES. That's the calling of the pastor, and is intended to compliment the other ministerial gifts/callings that are provided for the perfection of the saints.

I think the above needs repeating!
Add to that the fact that the Pastor should be the chief servant. A pastor who does that probably won't have a whole lot of trouble getting people to follow when he believes the Lord is leading. He has nothing to prove, so he is not overbearing. He is secure in his salvation so he doesn't need power.

[StillStanding]

I've had the privilege of sitting under some good pastors throughout my life. A few of them took it very personal when folks didn't do exactly what they preached on. In a few instances this turned into a power move that caused tension in the entire church.

They were good men that didn't understand the servant concept. Pastors are human beings. Some do a better job than others.

[Digging4Truth]

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

How could someone sincerely believe that a Pastor is not necessary? Didn't God establish is church WITH a form of government for His people?

How many would say...

How could someone sincerely believe that a teacher is not necessary.

or

How could someone sincerely believe that a prophet is not necessary.

or

How could someone sincerely believe that an apostle is not necessary.

Very few... unless they were attempting to cover bases they see were being missed by a post like this one.

God made 5 equal ministries. Ministries of which there might be multiple people in any congregation who operated in those ministries.

And yet one of them is the one that must be permanent. Must be had. Must be present.

The others... if they are in operation at all are most often brought in from other places for a "revival".

I will never understand the totally off balance view of the 5 fold ministery.

What we see today is PASTOR... and his four little friends who live out of town and rarely visit... and a few of them are a little... you know... weird... so we don't have them around any more...