Abolishing guns reduces crime??

[Baron1710]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Bro...I believe real men trust Jesus. I trust that God will protect my family from such a circumstance. Do you believe God will allow someone to rape or murder your family?

I believe the spiritually immature don't trust God to protect them...so naturally they need guns and knives etc.

Right, no Christian woman has ever been raped. This kind of stupidity makes me angry, not only do you put your own wife at risk, but you try to convince others to do the same.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Baron1710

Right, no Christian woman has ever been raped. This kind of stupidity makes me angry, not only do you put your own wife at risk, but you try to convince others to do the same.

Due to your own carnal thinking you're misinterpreting what I'm saying.

No man can add a day or an hour to his life. God is in control. God has a purpose and a plan in all things. I know many have been brutalized...but the issue isn't "Gee, where was God, I should have carried a gun!"

I don't know, y'all have nearly convinced me we're on our own down here. At least that's the popular sentiment I'm hearing. I was brought up to believe that God has a plan and a purpose in all the things we face in life. Nothing comes our way that catches him by suprise.

My brother was killed...while I don't know God's plan and purpose in my brother's death I trust that God is, was, and always will be in control.

I've read stories about missionaries that were brutalized. They all trust God in the storms of life....they don't wish they had blown someone away.

[Baron1710]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Due to your own carnal thinking you're misinterpreting what I'm saying.

No man can add a day or an hour to his life. God is in control. God has a purpose and a plan in all things. I know many have been brutalized...but the issue isn't "Gee, where was God, I should have carried a gun!"

I don't know, y'all have nearly convinced me we're on our own down here. At least that's the popular sentiment I'm hearing. I was brought up to believe that God has a plan and a purpose in all the things we face in life. Nothing comes our way that catches him by suprise.

My brother was killed...while I don't know God's plan and purpose in my brother's death I trust that God is, was, and always will be in control.

I've read stories about missionaries that were brutalized. They all trust God in the storms of life....they don't wish they had blown someone away.

I guess I believe a little more in freewill if you believe in predestination that works.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Baron1710

I guess I believe a little more in freewill if you believe in predestination that works.

Do you believe that God is up in Heaving "hoping" everything will turn out ok for you? Nothing can or will happen to you that isn't part of God's will and purpose in your life. You can't add a day to your life. You can't add an inch to your stature. We think we're in control...when we're not. We clench our guns like security blankets hoping they will protect us and help us add a day to our lives. Bro...God is in absolute control.

When Paul barged into Christian homes to have Christians slaughtered...if you were one of those Christians...would you have blown him away?

Either you trust him or you don't.

[Baron1710]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Do you believe that God is up in Heaving "hoping" everything will turn out ok for you?

I guess I will just sit right here and do nothing, God has it all under control. whatever happens, well he planned it. What about personal responsibility?

[Aquila]

Here’s an interesting excerpt from Bro. David K. Bernard’s book, Practical Holiness, that might help you understand the complexity of this moral position....

“Defense of Self and Family

How should we defend ourselves or our families
against murderous attacks? John Yoder’s book, What
Would You Do?, lists the options available to the Christian
who is committed to pacifism: martyrdom, divine
intervention, ruse, nonlethal violence, or moral disarming.
This last category includes such things as showing
respect, showing love, or asserting moral authority, which
often so affect the attacker that he changes his mind.
Yoder gave six actual case studies, ranging from wartime
to a prison riot to a mugging, in which nonviolent
methods stopped a lethal attack.

We do not interpret Christ’s teaching to mean we
must passively, idly watch while an attacker seriously
injures or kills someone. Under some circumstances, it
would be appropriate to use the minimum force necessary
to halt, ward off, or incapacitate the attacker. The
motivation in such a case must not be hatred, retaliation,
revenge, desire to harm, or desire to fight, but simply
protection against harm. Under no circumstances, however,
should we deliberately seek to kill the attacker. We
can seek to prevent evil, but not at the expense of
performing an equal or greater evil. It is essentially wrong
to use physical force except in cases of extreme necessity,
and then not to the point of taking a life.

From a spiritual perspective, the Christian should not
fear death. It would be better for the Christian to die and
be with the Lord than for his attacker to die and be forever
lost. Jesus and Stephen set the example by praying
for their murderers. Through their courageous deaths
onlookers such as the Roman centurion and (as some
scholars propose) Saul of Tarsus came to a knowledge of
the truth.

In the vast majority of self defense situations, we
would not face the choice of killing or being killed. We
must trust God to keep us from or to protect us in the
extremely rare cases of this nature. Moreover, we must
use prudence and not place ourselves in situations where
we might be forced to make this decision.


Bearing Arms

If we reject deadly force as an option, then the bear-
ing of arms becomes problematic. It could reflect a fundamental
lack of faith in God’s protective power (Job
1:9-12; 2:6) and the protective ministry of angels (Psalm
34:7; 91:11). If God prohibits killing, what is the purpose
of carrying a deadly weapon? In a time of crisis, can we
trust ourselves not to use it lethally? If a potential victim
produces a weapon, he forces the attacker to act violently
and often places himself in greater danger. Furthermore,
these weapons kill many more people in accidents and
arguments than in self-defense situations.

Why did Jesus tell His disciples on one occasion to
carry swords? (Luke 22:35-38). After the Last Supper,
Jesus gave new instructions to His disciples relative to the
preaching of the gospel. Earlier in His ministry, He had
sent them out without purse (money) or bag (supply of
food), telling them to depend upon the hospitality of the
people. Now, however, He told them to take purse, bag,
and sword. Possibly, He meant for them to take swords for
protection against wild beasts and robbers (to frighten off
or ward off the latter, not to kill them).

More probably, His allusion to the sword was
metaphoric. In other words, He was warning that they
would no longer enjoy a hearty welcome in every place,
but would face bitter opposition. Therefore, they should
learn to provide for themselves and to brace themselves
spiritually against attack and persecution.

Upon hearing this, the disciples found two swords
and brought them to Christ. He told them, “It is enough.”
Two swords are not adequate for twelve men. Apparently,
the disciples failed to understand Christ’s real meaning
at that time. When He saw them bringing two literal
swords, He decided to drop the subject. This view receives
support from Christ’s admonition to Peter a short time
later. When Peter actually tried to use one of these swords
in Christ’s defense, He forbade him with words that
denounce all killing. Furthermore, never again do we hear
of the disciples resisting violence with violence, although
they were subjected to violence many times.”
-Rev. David K. Bernard, Practical Holiness

[Baron1710]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Here’s an interesting excerpt from Bro. David K. Bernard’s book, Practical Holiness, that might help you understand the complexity of this moral position....

Couldn't disagree more. When we were going through this book at CLC I asked Dr. Segraves about this position. He chuckled and said, "Well nobody on this campus holds this view that I know of."

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Baron1710

Couldn't disagree more. When we were going through this book at CLC I asked Dr. Segraves about this position. He chuckled and said, "Well nobody on this campus holds this view that I know of."

This is a narrow way brother and the closer you walk with the Lord the more narrow it will become. You can choose to follow the majority if you like. But as for me and my house...Jesus is our example.

Can you provide just one example of a Christian using lethal physical force in the Bible? Christians were persecuted mercilessly by the Jews and later by the Romans. I'm sure you can at least find one if we have a "Christian responsibility" to use lethal force to defend ourselves.

I believe that Dr. Seagraves was obviously walking in the flesh and not the Spirit when he said that.

Being a Christian will cost something. It's about so much more than dress codes and church meetings.

[Baron1710]

Originally Posted by Aquila

This is a narrow way brother and the closer you walk with the Lord the more narrow it will become. You can choose to follow the majority if you like. But as for me and my house...Jesus is our example.

Can you provide just one example of a Christian using lethal physical force in the Bible? Christians were persecuted mercilessly by the Jews and later by the Romans. I'm sure you can at least find one if we have a "Christian responsibility" to use lethal force to defend ourselves.

Dr. Seagraves was obviously walking in the flesh and not the Spirit.

Being a Christian will cost something. It's about so much more than dress codes and church meetings.

Anybody that doesn't agree with you is in the flesh, I get it.

[Cindy]

Originally Posted by clgustaveson

I know this is kind of a random post but I was just accepted as a County Reserve.... which means I get a gun and a badge!

Use both wisely. Congrats.