Whoa! Polygamist solution is frightening...

[Pressing-On]

Recapping the case.

I'm in favor of what has happened. What they practice is against the law of God and against the law of the state. Close it down and take the children away from their mothers.

Points:

Though Mormon church founder Joseph Smith reported in 1843 that God commanded plural marriage as a path to the highest level of heaven, the church disavowed polygamy in 1890. Several sects, including the FLDS, split with the main church and continued to practice polygamy.

The underage marriages were condoned by the girls' parents.

In Texas, it is a felony to have sex with a person younger than 17 if the perpetrator is more than three years older than the teen. Sex with any child younger than 14 is considered aggravated sexual assault.

"Religion appears to play little or no role in the allegations about practices at the Eldorado ranch. No religious belief held by an adult justifies any kind of child abuse. No religious belief allows an adult to have sex with an underage girl. One fear is that any children that you don't remove will be themselves abused, and the other fear is that any children you don't remove will be whisked out of the state, which both puts them at risk potentially and impedes an investigation" " Scott McCown, a former district judge.

Most of these children, like the young babies, there is no evidence whatsoever they were under any threat of being physically or sexually abused. You are removing children because 12 or 14 years down the line, they are gong to be sexually molested.

Leaving the Eldorado ranch families intact was not a viable option. Investigators found clear evidence of a pattern of sexual abuse, including 20 girls who had been impregnated between the ages of 13 and 16 and boys who were being indoctrinated to become adult perpretrators of sexual abuse.

State Rep. Harvey Hilderbran, R-Kerrville whose district includes Eldorado, speculated that law enforcement and CPS probably had a loose plan in place. Hilderbran remembers talking to CPS officials about the ranch in 2005, when he worked to pass a bill targeted at the sect that raised the legal marriage age with parental consent from 14 to 16. The bill passed.

[revrandy]

It is amazing the power that one man can hold over people to lead them to believe this stuff....

[Rico]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

Recapping the case.

I'm in favor of what has happened. What they practice is against the law of God and against the law of the state. Close it down and take the children away from their mothers.

Points:

Though Mormon church founder Joseph Smith reported in 1843 that God commanded plural marriage as a path to the highest level of heaven, the church disavowed polygamy in 1890. Several sects, including the FLDS, split with the main church and continued to practice polygamy.

The underage marriages were condoned by the girls' parents.

In Texas, it is a felony to have sex with a person younger than 17 if the perpetrator is more than three years older than the teen. Sex with any child younger than 14 is considered aggravated sexual assault.

"Religion appears to play little or no role in the allegations about practices at the Eldorado ranch. No religious belief held by an adult justifies any kind of child abuse. No religious belief allows an adult to have sex with an underage girl. One fear is that any children that you don't remove will be themselves abused, and the other fear is that any children you don't remove will be whisked out of the state, which both puts them at risk potentially and impedes an investigation" " Scott McCown, a former district judge.

Most of these children, like the young babies, there is no evidence whatsoever they were under any threat of being physically or sexually abused. You are removing children because 12 or 14 years down the line, they are gong to be sexually molested.

Leaving the Eldorado ranch families intact was not a viable option. Investigators found clear evidence of a pattern of sexual abuse, including 20 girls who had been impregnated between the ages of 13 and 16 and boys who were being indoctrinated to become adult perpretrators of sexual abuse.

State Rep. Harvey Hilderbran, R-Kerrville whose district includes Eldorado, speculated that law enforcement and CPS probably had a loose plan in place. Hilderbran remembers talking to CPS officials about the ranch in 2005, when he worked to pass a bill targeted at the sect that raised the legal marriage age with parental consent from 14 to 16. The bill passed.

PO, included in the roundup were families that do not practice polygamy. Still, the State has taken their children away. What happened in Texas is wrong. If the State has specific information on specific molesters that's one thing. Rounding everyone up, however, is another thing entirely. If Texas is allowed to get away with what they have done, a dangerous precedent has been set.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Rico

PO, included in the roundup were families that do not practice polygamy. Still, the State has taken their children away. What happened in Texas is wrong. If the State has specific information on specific molesters that's one thing. Rounding everyone up, however, is another thing entirely. If Texas is allowed to get away with what they have done, a dangerous precedent has been set.

I haven't read that "factions" of the sect do not practice polygamy. I'm in favor of closing it down.

If the leader of the sect is in favor of polygamous, underaged relationships then the whole compound needs to be dissolved. It's still against the Word of God and the laws of the state of Texas.

What I am uncomfortable with is placing the children in CPS to be fostered out. CPS is a mess and there are too many bad reports of abused children in the foster homes only wanting the money and not caring for the children.

I talked with a women, just recently, who is a caseworker with a "non-profit" organization that places children in foster homes. They do very extensive background checks and consistent follow up.

[Rico]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

I haven't read that "factions" of the sect do not practice polygamy.

.

Here ya go.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080426/...st_retreat_406

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Rico

Here ya go.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080426/...st_retreat_406

Thanks, Rico. Interesting since this is what I am reading - "The sect believes polygamy brings glorification in heaven...."

"CPS officials say no more than 30 minor girls in state custody have children."

Hmmmm no more than "30".

"One FLDS member who did testify said she and her husband and their three children form a traditional family and live in a separate house from other sect members."

I'd have to know how that is working for them. Hmmmmmm...... living in and amongst a sect. Hmmmmm........

[Rico]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

Thanks, Rico. Interesting since this is what I am reading - "The sect believes polygamy brings glorification in heaven...."

"CPS officials say no more than 30 minor girls in state custody have children."

Hmmmm no more than "30".

"One FLDS member who did testify said she and her husband and their three children form a traditional family and live in a separate house from other sect members."

I'd have to know how that is working for them. Hmmmmmm...... living in and amongst a sect. Hmmmmm........

The point is that the State of Texas should not have rounded up everyone. It sets a dangerous precedent, PO; one that could have far reaching effects all over the USA. All the government would have to do is say children are in danger because of what a church teaches and then take the church members' children away.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Rico

The point is that the State of Texas should not have rounded up everyone. It sets a dangerous precedent, PO; one that could have far reaching effects all over the USA. All the government would have to do is say children are in danger because of what a church teaches and then take the church members' children away.

I'm sorry, Rico, but if they did not have "30" underaged pregnancies I'm not prepared to believe anything would have happened.

The thing is Texas knew why they moved here and why they set up the compound.

Don't forget this information.

State Rep. Harvey Hilderbran, R-Kerrville whose district includes Eldorado, speculated that law enforcement and CPS probably had a loose plan in place. Hilderbran remembers talking to CPS officials about the ranch in 2005, when he worked to pass a bill targeted at the sect that raised the legal marriage age with parental consent from 14 to 16. The bill passed.

They knew what they were doing and were waiting for them to cross the line - which they did. They were not coming at them for their religious beliefs, per se, but that their beliefs violated the law concerning sexual abuse.

Every family living on that compound is accountable. I wouldn't want any child to grow up in that environment. If they could place them through a "non-profit" fostering organization I wouldn't be as worried about the children. CPS is a joke, for the most part.

My SIL worked for them in Dallas for a while. A caseworker. She said they don't care about the children or the families, so she quit.

[Sister Alvear]

I think the state went about it wrong...

[Hoovie]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

I'm sorry, Rico, but if they did not have "30" underaged pregnancies I'm not prepared to believe anything would have happened.The thing is Texas knew why they moved here and why they set up the compound.

Don't forget this information.




They knew what they were doing and were waiting for them to cross the line - which they did. They were not coming at them for their religious beliefs, per se, but that their beliefs violated the law concerning sexual abuse.

Every family living on that compound is accountable. I wouldn't want any child to grow up in that environment. If they could place them through a "non-profit" fostering organization I wouldn't be as worried about the children. CPS is a joke, for the most part.

My SIL worked for them in Dallas for a while. A caseworker. She said they don't care about the children or the families, so she quit.

We have more than that in our local high school every year!