Why shouldn't I vote for Obama??

[ChristopherHall]

I long for the day of civil dialogue between Christians in both parties.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Hey, it's obvious that I'm not welcome in the Apostolic movement because I'm not a rightwing conservative. My church is largely extremist and the pastor rants over phony internet rumors and emails, like a few folks here. I can’t take this. I thought Christians were of another world. From here I’ve been considering leaving church for a while and these discussions have convinced me that there isn’t a place for me in the church. I’m tired of it. I still believe in the Apostolic Truth but this is too much. I’m voting Democratic and I know that disqualifies me from being a Christian. So be it. You will not brow beat me into voting for some rightwing nutcase.

lol....who is a right wing nutcase? Most of them are closer to central as are your Democratic icons too. They are all nutcases. This whole world is full of nutcases.

The fact that we and everyone else can tear each other down over what is happening in the political WORLD shows how far from God we really are IMHO

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Bro. They made it clear. I'm not a Christian. I'm not a real Apostolic. I'm trash because I don't agree with them politically. That's fine. I've tried to show why, as a Christian, I feel the other side can reduce abortion and address some very important issues. But the more I try to make my case the more they brow beat me. I know people from Europe and other countries who love the Lord and have explained that America's just too narrow visioned to address the issue, and I was believing there was a way to help people here see that we can do what they've done there. But nobody cares. I'm tired of trying to prove that I'm still a Christian who loves Jesus as much as they do just because I disagree with them. They don't believe I'm an Apostolic, fine. I'm tired of fighting. My job got moved overseas and now I got a new one and can barely make it by. In a couple years I don' tthink my family will hhave helath insurance. And no body cares. No body cares. No body cares. If I was an unborn baby they'd care. If my son was an unborn baby they'd care. But I'm not so I'm expendable, my family is expendable. As long as they get their precious tax cuts. My church wont help us pay oru medical bills. The only one's even acting like they care are the Democrats. And my brothers don't think I'm a Christian on top of this. I'm tired of even trying to show them I'm a Christian too. I'll just agree with them. I'm not a Christian. And because I'm going to vote democratic, I'm not a real Apostolic either. And you know what. They don't care. Their going to be happy I'm lost, becuase I didn't agree with their rightwing extremist politics.

Not everyone did that. And you did insinuate someone else was pro-abortion here, even if you later explained it, that was how it appeared...

Reminds me of the Endtime intro "Look, there are two things I don't discuss...politics and religion"

You have done your fair share of finger pointing too...and here you are just going hysterical lol "Their going to be happey I'm Lost"...you're BOTH doing it.

Maybe it's time you BOTH chilled out and have more respect for each other personally while disagreeing with each other's views?

I can shut the thread down if that is what it takes for everyone to calm down......

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Stephen Hoover

On a "lighter" note....


One reason abortion is down in Europe is because the male sperm count is much lower than in the US.

There ya go. All you guys get on an estrogen pill and get separate bedrooms!

oh goodness......

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by scotty

A bit dramatic I do believe, it is almost as if you are pouting now. It is compromise. You can not compromise sin in order to be better off financially, which is basicly what you are arguing for. God will take care you and your family if you live for Him. You are putting too much trust into man. Man will fail you.

Not if he thinks it's a sin to allow the rich to get richer at the expense of the poor and not provide health care for everyone....he may just in his mind be picking the lessor of two evils. He might be wrong, but consider that this might be how he sees things

[Sister Alvear]

ha...............................we had 4 babies dedicated Sunday ...sure can tell who is not watching television at night! ha...
Love you folks...

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by scotty

Well when you have some time go back read the exchange we had over the weekend. Between him and Bro. Hall I had to wrap my head with duct tape to keep it from exploding.

too bad the duct tape didn't help you

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by ChristopherHall

I understand what the both of you are teaching us about the dangers Muslims pose toward us as a nation. You're right. Muslims are very dangerous. I see even the moderates as time bombs. What I'm primarily taking issue with is the idea that Obama is a Muslim. I honestly don't believe he is. He is a liberal Christian, no doubt about that, but I don't believe he's a Muslim. In fact I believe that false accusations discredit us. False accusations make us look paranoid and irrational. I assure you, if Obama is some secret Muslim plant the political machine of the Republican Party will solidly reveal it for all to see and verify. I believe we're just dealing with a liberal here. If we discredit ourselves publicly, no one is going to believe us. And some day, it may matter. For example, I heard a pastor say that Obama was raised Muslim and attended a Madrassa, or whatever it's called. He raved about it for a while and it was a mess of both internet rumor and his own imagination. I just listened thinking...how can I ever trust a preacher again, especially this preacher? I began thinking of all the wonderful miracles he had testified about in sermons, miracles I believed. I can't believe him anymore. I certainly can't teach my son to trust his word or believe his stories. When we repeat, say, or claim outlandish false stories about people we loose all creditability.

So yes, I'm with you on Muslims. I think they should be watch-listed and if any questionable activity takes place their mosques should be shut down and the leadership held for questioning. But we should save the warnings for true threats not allowing fear and paranoia to provoke us to overreacting.

Those are just my thoughts.

Exactly, but he is too busy labeling everyone blind and whatever else to sink his brain into that point

[George]

Originally Posted by ChristopherHall

I understand what the both of you are teaching us about the dangers Muslims pose toward us as a nation.*** You're right.*** Muslims are very dangerous.*** I see even the moderates as time bombs.*** What I'm primarily taking issue with is the idea that Obama is a Muslim.*** I honestly don't believe he is.*** He is a liberal Christian, no doubt about that, but I don't believe he's a Muslim.*** In fact I believe that false accusations discredit us.*** False accusations make us look paranoid and irrational.*** I assure you, if Obama is some secret Muslim plant the political machine of the Republican Party will solidly reveal it for all to see and verify.*** I believe we're just dealing with a liberal here.*** If we discredit ourselves publicly, no one is going to believe us.*** And some day, it may matter.*** For example, I heard a pastor say that Obama was raised Muslim and attended a Madrassa, or whatever it's called.*** He raved about it for a while and it was a mess of both internet rumor and his own imagination.*** I just listened thinking...how can I ever trust a preacher again, especially this preacher?*** I began thinking of all the wonderful miracles he had testified about in sermons, miracles I believed.*** I can't believe him anymore.*** I certainly can't teach my son to trust his word or believe his stories.*** When we repeat, say, or claim outlandish false stories about people we loose all creditability.So yes, I'm with you on Muslims.*** I think they should be watch-listed and if any questionable activity takes place their mosques should be shut down and the leadership held for questioning.****** But we should save the warnings for true threats not allowing fear and paranoia to provoke us to overreacting.*** Those are just my thoughts.

And, if you would have read my comments in their entirety, you would know I never said Obama was Muslim. I do believe, however, he is inclined toward Islam for several reasons. One being, he would have received Islamic indoctrination in the school he attended regardless of it being public or a radlical Muslim school. Even other American kids who may have attended the school would have received this teaching. Even though he denies any claim toward Islam, it is still a part of his life and I don't think he denies it in his heart. The so-called Christian church he is supposedly a member of, in my opinion, supports Islamic beliefs. For one, the attire of the men in their choir is Muslim. The style of the attire and the hats they wear are not just African clothes. Before you crucify me and say Muslims in America don't dress that way, let me say it is the way of Islam to dress as such in foreign countries and many of their ministers in America wear that style. None of my opinions have been based on any type of internet rumors, e-mails or such. I have formed my own opinion from my foreign experience in third world countries, things I have seen on Obama's church website, and his own words from the books he wrote. With my foreign understanding, I have made my conclusions. Now, Mark has stated he believes Obama is a closet Muslim. As for me, I would not fight Mark on this statement because there may come a day that his gut feelings become reality. It is possible. Obama has only gained such huge popularity because of Oprah. His meeting in S.C. was supposed to be at 5600 seat convention center until she endorsed him. They then moved the meeting to a 70,000 seat arena. That is even further disturbing me. People are voting for him because they are starstruck with Oprah.

[chosenbyone]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Hey, it's obvious that I'm not welcome in the Apostolic movement because I'm not a rightwing conservative. My church is largely extremist and the pastor rants over phony internet rumors and emails, like a few folks here. I can’t take this. I thought Christians were of another world. From here I’ve been considering leaving church for a while and these discussions have convinced me that there isn’t a place for me in the church. I’m tired of it. I still believe in the Apostolic Truth but this is too much. I’m voting Democratic and I know that disqualifies me from being a Christian. So be it. You will not brow beat me into voting for some rightwing nutcase.

At first, I thought you were trying to be funny about not being welcomed in the Apostolic movement because of your political views, but I soon realized that you may have been serious. I wanted to declare that Apostolic Christians were a diverse group of people who agreed on doctrine - and that was about all!

As StMark and DT mentioned, you must have thicker skin than what you have shown this evening. Politics and religion have notoriously been hot button topics and sometimes you just need to stay out of the fray in order to keep peace in your life.

By the way, if you were looking for a reason to quit going to church, you may want to try a different angle than "I am not a rightwing conservative and the Apostolic church doesn't consider me a Christian", because that was just nonsense. God loves you and so do the members of AFF, so quit entertaining ideas that would dictate otherwise.