Question about Acts 2:38: What about the martyrs?

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by mfblume

What I am trying to say has nothing to do with what I FEEL about muslims. That would be a subjective response. Mine is objective. their DOCTRINE is salvation by works

well, i am not qualified to speak to that except to say again that Muslims have Job also, although they call him something else...Ayyub? And i am not interested in judging people on their doctrines, as it appears God is not. All Muslims are not lost, and if you even think that in your heart, you are condemned, it seems clear to me. Pentecostalism is quintessentially American, and mirrors the rise and fall of America--and its doctrines, also, are just the musings of men who have decided upon an agenda. If "doctrine" = "what men have decided Scripture means," then to hell with your doctrine, with all due respect.

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by thephnxman

That's why muslims cannot understand the BIBLE.

tell it to the Good Samaritan; or understand his lesson. He does not care about any doctrines of men.

[shazeep]

"You will know them by their FRUIT."

perhaps this is all that Muslim doctrine is attempting to convey.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by shazeep

well, i am not qualified to speak to that except to say again that Muslims have Job also, although they call him something else...Ayyub? And i am not interested in judging people on their doctrines, as it appears God is not. All Muslims are not lost, and if you even think that in your heart, you are condemned, it seems clear to me. Pentecostalism is quintessentially American, and mirrors the rise and fall of America--and its doctrines, also, are just the musings of men who have decided upon an agenda. If "doctrine" = "what men have decided Scripture means," then to hell with your doctrine, with all due respect.

Still not getting it.

Where on earth do you get the idea God does not judge people by their doctrine? If his words condemn a doctrine it is saying those who believe it are lost.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by shazeep

"You will know them by their FRUIT."

perhaps this is all that Muslim doctrine is attempting to convey.

Fruit that is of human will power, by salvation by works, is not correct fruit. Even the false tree had good in the knowledge of good and evil.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by shazeep

tell it to the Good Samaritan; or understand his lesson. He does not care about any doctrines of men.

The bible forbids doctrine of salvation by works.

Overall you're saying we cannot stand on a bible doctrine, and there really is no bible doctrine. And that is very wrong. It's the error that says so long as you're honest you're okay.

[mfblume]

According to some. ..

1Ti 4:16 Take heed unto thyself, and unto the doctrine; continue in them: for in doing this thou shalt both save thyself, and them that hear thee.

But it won't really save you.


1Ti 4:13 Till I come, give attendance to reading, to exhortation, to doctrine.

But don't really give attendance to doctrine.


Act 2:42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers

Waste of time continuing in doctrine though.


Rom 6:17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.

Set free from sin by obeying doctrine? Nahhh.


Rom 16:17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them

Can't mean what it says. Doctrine is not in the bible! Doctrine is only man's. That would be judging people by their doctrine. Nahh.


2Ti 3:10 But thou hast fully known my doctrine, manner of life, purpose, faith, longsuffering, charity, patience

Paul, who cares about your doctrine. Doctrines are of no concern to God .


2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness

Get doctrine from scripture? Nahhh.


2Ti 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

Endure sound doctrine? Doctrine is if man not God. How can there be sound doctrine? That's a bad word. ... doctrine.


2Jn 1:9 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.

God can't have a doctrine. If he did he would judge people by Doctrines. Can't be true.


2Jn 1:10 If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed

Can't judge people by doctrine so you're wrong, John.


1Jn 4:6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

If people don't hear the apostles, they're not of God? Nah. That's judging people by their Doctrines. God wouldn't do that. Wrong again, John.

[thephnxman]

Originally Posted by shazeep

tell it to the Good Samaritan; or understand his lesson. He does not care about any doctrines of men.

Is islam a religion of non-violence, consisting of good samaritans?

The Lord Jesus spoke about a "good samaritan" (as an individual). The heart of the matter is
that no religion has a monopoly on good works; neither is any one religion free of hypocrisy.

Islam serves the natural man and the god of this world: not that there another God, but
men would rather serve the god they can relate to: one that condones murdering women
and children, as do muslims.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by shazeep

ha ok fair enough, perhaps--i came back here to fix my reaction, and you just beat me here. i know some this may seem heretical to you; but i suggest that you are a long way from Azusa St. now--prolly closer to ISIS, believe it or not--and so maybe it would be better if you just refute what you quoted specifically, or point out any ego in it, ty.

Is English your first language?

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Still not getting it.

Where on earth do you get the idea God does not judge people by their doctrine? If his words condemn a doctrine it is saying those who believe it are lost.

i am not trying to "get it," mike, at least as long as "it" is how i might come to once again feel qualified to judge others. That is God's prerogative, however i do not believe the Good Samaritan would agree with your conclusions. So, if you wish to pursue this, you might provide an example of where God judged an individual based upon their doctrine, and we'll see what light may come of it.

Since i neither know nor care much about Muslim doctrine, i am left to reflect upon how Pent doctrine has remained from Azusa St to today, and the obvious differences that obtain--the point being that doctrine works great, until it replaces Scripture, i bet; the one being dead while the other is so alive. Doctrine is a trick, that one may imagine their salvation comes from a little ritual utterance and a dunk, and then they should go start imparting all their knowledge to others.

So show me where God has left off judging one's heart, and now judges doctrine, if you can; and see that this is futile, an invitation to place oneself back under the Law. Unless "Love your neighbor" has suddenly become a doctrine?