A Cult vs. A Church

[shazeep]

very cool! you omit the point of even going to these..."doctors," but whatever!

[Livelystone]

Originally Posted by shazeep

very cool! you omit the point of even going to these..."doctors," but whatever!

I think your point is very valid

On one hand if I stopped going to the VA my monthly disability payments (got my ears blown out in the army and have extremely impaired hearing) may well be put in jeopardy.

On the other hand I frequently wonder if because of what I allow them to do for me regarding other physical issues, if this is keeping me from being healed from these same issues?

I know if I skip my BP pill by noon I have an awesome headache.

So does my daily taking medications paid for by the VA interfere with my daily walk with the Lord?

If we reach into the cupboards to get OTC or scrip pain meds are we insulting God?

What I do know is God does not change (other than extending mercy in place of judgment) and only God can do miracles. God wants to do miracles because when He does He is glorified by them. Consequently, and IMO, if a church is never witnessing miracles is because God is not moving on their behalf and there is a reason why He is not.

[shazeep]

amen. i would posit that we insulate ourselves from God, in a million ways. Some obvious, some not so much. You don't have high bp due to a lack of coumadin (or whatever), but most likely are chronically deficient in Omega 3 and vitamin D, both of which used to come in our grass fed protein, and neither of which your Dr is interested in testing you for. I can say that even your Dr knows that anyone taking omega 3 cannot take blood thinners.

but you are in somewhat of a position there; i would prolly fill the meds, and then toss them

[Esphes45]

If you don't believe there is such a thing as a "perfect church" then you must not believe that God is a perfect God and Ephes 4:27.

I should not expect garbage coming out of HIS church.

[Livelystone]

Originally Posted by Esphes45

If you don't believe there is such a thing as a "perfect church" then you must not believe that God is a perfect God and Ephes 4:27.

I should not expect garbage coming out of HIS church.

Do you know of one?

No, you do not!

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by Esphes45

If you don't believe there is such a thing as a "perfect church" then you must not believe that God is a perfect God and Ephes 4:27.

I should not expect garbage coming out of HIS church.

seems like that by this reasoning the pharisees would have represented perfection also.

[Livelystone]

Originally Posted by shazeep

seems like that by this reasoning the pharisees would have represented perfection also.

I think most of us have heard the saying that if we should find a perfect church, as soon as we joined it would no longer be perfect.

Rightfully we demand more of the clergy, and equally right is we should never be led in any direction by the clergy other than the truth.

The latter is why the church today is in the terrible condition it is in.

God gave us a method rooted in the law for how all truth and non truth can be 'lawfully' determined.

Where can a lengthy study be posted here?

[shazeep]

well, anywhere, right here--but more often a link is given, with a synopsis. after all, most who bother to come here will also be familiar with the method, surely, and those who aren't may access the link.

one has to wonder if the expectations of the clergy lead to unrighteous demands of it, however. If a people set up a priest, don't be surprised when you get a priest, iow. You would blame the priest, when Scripture tells us not to have a human priest? With this premise, then, how can truth be determined?

[thephnxman]

Originally Posted by Livelystone

I think most of us have heard the saying that if we should find a perfect church, as soon as we joined it would no longer be perfect.
Rightfully we demand more of the clergy, and equally right is we should never be led in any direction by the clergy other than the truth.
The latter is why the church today is in the terrible condition it is in.
God gave us a method rooted in the law for how all truth and non truth can be 'lawfully' determined.
Where can a lengthy study be posted here?

The Church is holy, perfect, and pure.

That is not to say that everyone who professes Christianity is holy, perfect, and pure.
"For by one offering He has perfected forever them that are sanctified." so surely the
question becomes: Are we "sanctified"? Are we not to follow the Lord's lead:
"And for their sakes I sanctify MYSELF..."?

[Livelystone]

Originally Posted by thephnxman

The Church is holy, perfect, and pure.

That is not to say that everyone who professes Christianity is holy, perfect, and pure.
"For by one offering He has perfected forever them that are sanctified." so surely the
question becomes: Are we "sanctified"? Are we not to follow the Lord's lead:
"And for their sakes I sanctify MYSELF..."?

There is no one on earth who is holy, perfect, and pure!........ and this you can take to the bank

On the other hand, He who is in us is Holy, Perfect, Pure, is available to be completely formed in us (the Body of Christ on earth) providing we learn the truth of the doctrines of the foundation of Christ in us as listed in He.6;1-2. Without us assimilating the truth of these doctrines Christ cannot be formed in us.

Unfortunately, if what we learn about these foundational doctrines of Christ in us is not the truth, the spirit who is guiding us is not Christ in us but an impostor appearing as Christ in us as prophesied by Paul.

What Christians need to be able to do is allow Christ in us to become us. However, for this to happen we (the spirit of man AKA Adam in us ) needs to die before the fulness of the Spirit of Christ can be formed in us. Otherwise, all we will have in us is Christ the seed, instead of what we need to have in us that is Christ the full grown tree of life in us

This is easier said then done because the only thing that can displace the darkness of sin in us is the presence of the truth of He who has no sin in us.

Consequently, if a Christian is believing in the false doctrines of the foundation of Christ in us as taught in most of todays churches, it is not Christ in them who is guiding them day in and day out, but an impostor sent by Satan to fool them so they do his will and not the Will of God in the churches who claim His Name.