What the World Sees as Apostolic

[tv1a]

For those about to rock, we salute you. Then we are going to bed it's after 2pm Eastern Time. I turned the tv channel to the catholic channel and now I'm nodding off real bad. I have to get up in 3-4 hours...

[tv1a]

The icon I'm looking at in your post is spewing green stuff out like Linda Blair in the excorcist.

Originally Posted by Berkeley

smoke?? you mean the guys SHADOW???

[berkeley]

Originally Posted by tv1a

The icon I'm looking at in your post is spewing green stuff out like Linda Blair in the excorcist.

you are trippin!!

[Rhoni]

I will have to report: This goes along with the subject the thread began as...

During my 5 year period of getting out of Dodge [UPCI], I did visit many UPCI churches with friends or to see friends. When they chose threir text to shame/judge/blame me for my education, my lack of holding to the approved UPCI dress code...of course they turned me off and reminded me why I did not want to be a part of them any longer.

I will have to say that one very prominent preacher friend took a different approach; He spoke on how many of the dress standards were not a heaven or hell issue but they were there to identify one with a specific group of people. I was the target, and I heard EXACTLY what he was saying. Dress standards as mandated by many Apostolic churches are NOT heaven or hell issues and emphasis should not be placed on them. The thing that got me was this: I did NOT want to be identified in a retail store or a restaurant as one of them: You know, frizzy perms, jean skirts with bobby socks and tennis shoes, and RUDE...I hated to go in with an APOSTOLIC group that was demanding to the waitresses, let their children run around the tables without discipline, and the young people moving around until the waitress didn't know where to put the food, and then not leave a tip.

I DID NOT want to be identified with them. This Pastor did his best to win me back over and was totally perplexed why I did come back to a UPCI church in the area that was not his. The UPCI church I came back to accepted me like I was. They used me before I lined up to their platform standard and took many a hit for it. They didn't push me. They loved me.

Just thought I'd thorw this in there for those who wonder why they can't win who they consider 'backsliders' back to their assemblies. They know what they should and shouldn't do...they do not need these sermons tailored just for them in this way. The Pastor needs to preach what God lays on his heart and not be controlled by wanting to 'save' that person by preaching what they want them to hear. They need to be loved. That is the bottom line.

Blessings, Rhoni

[Rhoni]

Originally Posted by tv1a

I was speaking to a religious person today and the topic came up about what the difference is between apostolic and pentecostal. I asked her what she though apostolic meant and she ran down this list....

1. Dresses
2. Uncut Hair
3. No make-up
4. No television

She equates apostolics with legalism. She doesn't equate an apostolic as being a spirit filled believer who operates in the power and demonstration of the Holy Ghost.

She reinforces what a vast majority of people think about apostolics. There are some who are intellectually dishonest and would want to question the intelligence of this person, but she is a college graduate, has owned a business, and is a very active member of her church.

Can anyone explain again what legalism has to do with the '' apostle's doctrine''? The world isn't buying it one bit.

Check out the previous post...people don't need shame/blame/and judgement...they get enough of it from the world. They need to know that God loves them and accepts them as they are. They need to know that any changes that need to be made they have the time and the relationship to God to work on these things without man's interference.

Just my humble opinion.

Blessings, Rhoni

Originally Posted by OGIA

Bro. Strange,

I agree with your post, but I don't see what it has to do with the thread? Someone spoke to an educated, religious woman who thought "Apostolic" was defined by outward standards and with legalism. It was also said, "She doesn't equate an apostolic as being a spirit filled believer who operates in the power and demonstration of the Holy Ghost."

While your post has truth in it, it does not answer the problem this woman has. She might be educated and religious, but she is not born again (that I've read) and apparently no one has ever taken the time to talk with her about what she believes and why, and, even moreso, explain scripturally what "Apostolic" does mean.

I don't see it and can't assume it didn't happen, but I wonder if the originator of this thread has an Apostolic church which "operates in the power and demonstration of the Holy Ghost" to take her to? If so, was she invited?

Also, I wonder how the originator of this thread answered this educated, religious woman's definition? Did he/she attempt to define "Apostolic" by scripture, or did he/she just agree and reinforce this woman's ignorance? If the latter, then I don't know why he/she would even start this thread, seeing as he/she shirked his/her responsibility to this woman.

It's fun to come on and bash standards, but I wonder if the educated, religious woman in this thread is any closer to being born again than she was before the conversation? That's what it's all about, isn't it?

Central to the spirit of the title of this thread, "What the World Sees as Apostolic," lifts the curtain of discussion to reveal every species of dancing spirits in full motion. It was my purpose to address some of these spirits with the Word of God rather than to address a specific scenario presented by the originator of this thread.

It is a crying shame that, if it be so, that the attentions of the world have been focused upon our FLESH and how it is displayed before the world instead of the LIGHT of Christ so exibited within us. If we are so insane as to exhibit before the world OUR FLESH with its adornments or the lack of it, as our LIGHT from a city set upon a hill, our present day Apostolic doctrine has DECEIVED us.

Yet, I know this sad state of affair is true, calling it "separation," while it is not separation at all but rather, it has become just another sub-set of worldliness, abeit, religious worldliness.

So, the dance of spirits continued as this discussion ensued. Again, I want to re-empahsize that our LIGHT will never be a display of FLESH, regardless of how it is, or is not adorned, but rather as the song says...

If I can help somebody as I travel 'long
If I can help somebody with a word or song
If I can show somebody when he's travlin' wrong
Then my living shall not be in vain

If collectively we can embrace THIS focus, we will then give God glory and the world will see Jesus (the light) in us as a bright city set upon a hill that cannot be moved. Otherwise, we will, under the guise of Apostolic Doctrine continue to focus the attentions of the world upon (unholy) FLESH by which the world is not impressed. They already have plenty of their own.

Regardless, I suspect the endless dance of many and varied species of spirits will continue to infinity...or at least, until Jesus says, "ENOUGH."

[SDG]

Originally Posted by Brother Strange

Central to the spirit of the title of this thread, "What the World Sees as Apostolic," lifts the curtain of discussion to reveal every species of dancing spirits in full motion. It was my purpose to address some of these spirits with the Word of God rather than to address a specific scenario presented by the originator of this thread.

It is a crying shame that, if it be so, that the attentions of the world have been focused upon our FLESH and how it is displayed before the world instead of the LIGHT of Christ so exibited within us. If we are so insane as to exhibit before the world OUR FLESH with its adornments or the lack of it, as our LIGHT from a city set upon a hill, our present day Apostolic doctrine has DECEIVED us.

Yet, I know this sad state of affair is true, calling it "separation," while it is not separation at all but rather, it has become just another sub-set of worldliness, abeit, religious worldliness.

So, the dance of spirits continued as this discussion ensued. Again, I want to re-empahsize that our LIGHT will never be a display of FLESH, regardless of how it is, or is not adorned, but rather as the song says...

If I can help somebody as I travel 'long
If I can help somebody with a word or song
If I can show somebody when he's travlin' wrong
Then my living shall not be in vain

If collectively we can embrace THIS focus, we will then give God glory and the world will see Jesus (the light) in us as a bright city set upon a hill that cannot be moved. Otherwise, we will, under the guise of Apostolic Doctrine continue to focus the attentions of the world upon (unholy) FLESH by which the world is not impressed. They already have plenty of their own.

Regardless, I suspect the endless dance of many and varied species of spirits will continue to infinity...or at least, until Jesus says, "ENOUGH."

Tek has his Divine Flesh doctrine... while some have their unholy Flesh doctrine .... Elder ... I think you've coined a new phrase ....

Outstanding insights ....as always.

Originally Posted by Sheltiedad

I have to admit, my whole life when I have tried to explain the relatively obscure religion that I was raised in, I do not see a glimmer of recognition until I say, "you know, the one where the women only wear dresses, don't cut their hair, and don't wear make-up or jewelry"... at that time they usually go, "Oh, now I know the one you are talking about, I think one of those ladies works down the hall from me"...

If they HAVE heard of Pentecostals, they think you are Assembly of God.

I'm sure this means something but I'm not sure what... (actually I am but can't decide which path to take. lol)... I'm sure that those who only hang out with other Pentecostals will believe I am lying or be shocked to know that the majority of people do not even know what a Pentecostal is, let alone a Oneness Pentecostal.

Agree with you, the definition Apostolic and Pentecostals cover a whole range of groups. But if you say holiness standard ones, they'll say ok there the ones who don't cut or wear makeup right??? Never anything about one God or Jesus name, it's always dress.






:sshhh

Originally Posted by Rhoni

I will have to report: This goes along with the subject the thread began as...

During my 5 year period of getting out of Dodge [UPCI], I did visit many UPCI churches with friends or to see friends. When they chose threir text to shame/judge/blame me for my education, my lack of holding to the approved UPCI dress code...of course they turned me off and reminded me why I did not want to be a part of them any longer.

I will have to say that one very prominent preacher friend took a different approach; He spoke on how many of the dress standards were not a heaven or hell issue but they were there to identify one with a specific group of people. I was the target, and I heard EXACTLY what he was saying. Dress standards as mandated by many Apostolic churches are NOT heaven or hell issues and emphasis should not be placed on them. The thing that got me was this: I did NOT want to be identified in a retail store or a restaurant as one of them: You know, frizzy perms, jean skirts with bobby socks and tennis shoes, and RUDE...I hated to go in with an APOSTOLIC group that was demanding to the waitresses, let their children run around the tables without discipline, and the young people moving around until the waitress didn't know where to put the food, and then not leave a tip.

I DID NOT want to be identified with them. This Pastor did his best to win me back over and was totally perplexed why I did come back to a UPCI church in the area that was not his. The UPCI church I came back to accepted me like I was. They used me before I lined up to their platform standard and took many a hit for it. They didn't push me. They loved me.

Just thought I'd thorw this in there for those who wonder why they can't win who they consider 'backsliders' back to their assemblies. They know what they should and shouldn't do...they do not need these sermons tailored just for them in this way. The Pastor needs to preach what God lays on his heart and not be controlled by wanting to 'save' that person by preaching what they want them to hear. They need to be loved. That is the bottom line.

Blessings, Rhoni

[tv1a]

I can find a scripture defining Christian, I could find a scripture defining believer, I could find a scripture defining sinner. I told the pastor I don't want to be labeled that cannot be found in the Bible.

Originally Posted by Berkeley

you are trippin!!