The Apostolic Light Doctrine

Michael The Disciple · #1 04-13-2018, 07:27 AM

Something that I dont get. Many (not all) Oneness Pentecostals say there is absolutely no such thing as the "light doctrine". AND YET...among themselves that is exactly what they practice.

Here is an example from another thread:

Quote:

How could you sit here and say someone's ideas about the being pre trib, or post trib matters that way? All that is crazy, because no one living knows what it's going to be for sure.

Quote:

Eschatology though, is what it Is, only a philosophy. But hanging your hat on prophecy means nothing. If you believe in the second coming that's what matters. When it will happen, and how It will happen no one knows. I just know when it does come, I'm on that train! And hallelujah praise Jesus!

Is this the way to approach the foundation truths of Jesus Christ?

Many Trins when approached with more truth on who Jesus is would say exactly what this brother says about the rapture.

They say, why all the strife between Oneness and Trinity? We both believe Jesus is God! There scriptures either way! After all none of us no for sure! The main thing is to believe in obedience to Jesus!

Many (not all) OP would mock these Trins and say they are going to Hell because they dont love the truth but THEY THEMSELVES, among themselves can say, "We dont have to agree on the 2nd coming or the resurrection, or the eternal judgment!"

They reason "good men can differ in their understanding of these issues so as long as they believe on Oneness and Acts 2:38 their fine brethren!"

So they condemn to Hell one group with no exceptions, all that say they are a "Trinitarian" for not loving the truth but give themselves a pass on other foundation teachings of Jesus Christ.

To them what is essential is only a PART of the truth. Not ALL of the truth. They really think God will condemn people over teaching Oneness and Acts 2:38 wrong...but will accept THEM no matter what they believe!

1ofthechosen · #2 04-13-2018, 07:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Something that I dont get. Many (not all) Oneness Pentecostals say there is absolutely no such thing as the "light doctrine". AND YET...among themselves that is exactly what they practice.

Here is an example from another thread:

Is this the way to approach the foundation truths of Jesus Christ?

Many Trins when approached with more truth on who Jesus is would say exactly what this brother says about the rapture.

They say, why all the strife between Oneness and Trinity? We both believe Jesus is God! There scriptures either way! After all none of us no for sure! The main thing is to believe in obedience to Jesus!

Many (not all) OP would mock these Trins and say they are going to Hell because they dont love the truth but THEY THEMSELVES, among themselves can say, "We dont have to agree on the 2nd coming or the resurrection, or the eternal judgment!"

They reason "good men can differ in their understanding of these issues so as long as they believe on Oneness and Acts 2:38 their fine brethren!"

So they condemn to Hell one group with no exceptions, all that say they are a "Trinitarian" for not loving the truth but give themselves a pass on other foundation teachings of Jesus Christ.

To them what is essential is only a PART of the truth. Not ALL of the truth. They really think God will condemn people over teaching Oneness and Acts 2:38 wrong...but will accept THEM no matter what they believe!

You are teaching eschatology brings salvation? You got the cart before the horse. And most importantly you are missing the most important thing, you can't even say for sure. The second coming is going to happen. But you can't present enough evidence to say for sure when. Acts 2:38 is salvation it's the foundation, the Oneness of God is the foundation, Holiness is a foundation, but you can't present one scripture that says when the rapture is going to come (as that term is not even there), and at what point it's going to come, will effect your salvation. The main thing is we do like the 5 wise virgins and keep our lamps full of oil. Staying full of the Holy Ghost. For no man knows the day or the hour. So that we can hear the Trump,xoxxxo when it does happen! Youould get your foundation down, before you start working on the roof!!

Originalist · #3 04-13-2018, 07:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Something that I dont get. Many (not all) Oneness Pentecostals say there is absolutely no such thing as the "light doctrine". AND YET...among themselves that is exactly what they practice.

Here is an example from another thread:

Is this the way to approach the foundation truths of Jesus Christ?

Many Trins when approached with more truth on who Jesus is would say exactly what this brother says about the rapture.

They say, why all the strife between Oneness and Trinity? We both believe Jesus is God! There scriptures either way! After all none of us no for sure! The main thing is to believe in obedience to Jesus!

Many (not all) OP would mock these Trins and say they are going to Hell because they dont love the truth but THEY THEMSELVES, among themselves can say, "We dont have to agree on the 2nd coming or the resurrection, or the eternal judgment!"

They reason "good men can differ in their understanding of these issues so as long as they believe on Oneness and Acts 2:38 their fine brethren!"

So they condemn to Hell one group with no exceptions, all that say they are a "Trinitarian" for not loving the truth but give themselves a pass on other foundation teachings of Jesus Christ.

To them what is essential is only a PART of the truth. Not ALL of the truth. They really think God will condemn people over teaching Oneness and Acts 2:38 wrong...but will accept THEM no matter what they believe!

All valid points and concerns. But don't you sometimes just want to get away from all of this and just focus on HIM? I know I do. Without him I can do nothing. I need him now more than ever. No, I do not have all truth. No, I do not have a perfect understanding of the God head. I do not think any of do. But one think we do know, is that we need him more than the air we breathe. He is our very spiritual life. The Holy Ghost flowing through us is eternal life and peace. God help us not to be so focused on figuring out every mystery to the point that we lose focus of him in our lives.

1ofthechosen · #4 04-13-2018, 08:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Originalist

All valid points and concerns. But don't sometimes just want to get away from all of this and just focus on HIM. I know I do. Without him I can do nothing. I need him now more than ever. No, I do not have all truth. No, I do not have a perfect understanding of the God head. I do not think any of do. But one think we do know, is that we need him more than the air we breathe. He is our very spiritual life. The Holy Ghost flowing through us is eternal life and peace. God help us not to be so focused on figuring our every mystery to the point that we lose focus of him in our lives.

Amen!

Originalist · #5 04-13-2018, 09:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1ofthechosen

Amen!

I'm glad you understood my post even with all the typos.

Michael The Disciple · #6 04-13-2018, 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Originalist

All valid points and concerns. But don't you sometimes just want to get away from all of this and just focus on HIM? I know I do. Without him I can do nothing. I need him now more than ever. No, I do not have all truth. No, I do not have a perfect understanding of the God head. I do not think any of do. But one think we do know, is that we need him more than the air we breathe. He is our very spiritual life. The Holy Ghost flowing through us is eternal life and peace. God help us not to be so focused on figuring out every mystery to the point that we lose focus of him in our lives.

Well actually I do have a life with God. We have been abiding in each other for decades. But sure I know what you mean. Its not all just about doctrine.

Aquila · #7 04-13-2018, 08:11 AM

I don't buy into the Light Doctrine. That establishes a "doctrine" a "teaching" a principle that would permit anyone outside of full Acts 2:38 or Oneness to be saved based on what little they might know concerning the fullness of biblical truth.

What troubles me most about the Light Doctrine is that it would make NOT sharing the fullness of truth with other "Christians" in their best interest. It would be best to allow them to live in all the light they know and be saved, than to present the fullness of truth, risk them rejecting it, and then have them be condemned.

I'm of the opinion that there is absolutely no assurance of salvation outside of Acts 2:38. All we can do is entrust the fate of those faithful and devout Christians who die outside of Acts 2:38 into the hands of God. He is a righteous judge and will always do what is just. May God have mercy on their souls. And I think we should leave it there.

I cannot in good conscience refer to anyone outside of Acts 2:38 and tell you that they were saved with absolute assurance. Likewise, I cannot look at you and tell you in good conscience that I know how God will judge such a one and condemn them to Hell with absolute assurance. I can only entrust their fate to God, knowing He will judge righteously.

With that said, I admonish that we preach, teach, and obey Acts 2:38 so that we can share and experience the blessed assurance of eternal salvation.

1ofthechosen · #8 04-13-2018, 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aquila

I don't buy into the Light Doctrine. That establishes a "doctrine" a "teaching" a principle that would permit anyone outside of full Acts 2:38 or Oneness to be saved based on what little they might know concerning the fullness of biblical truth.

What troubles me most about the Light Doctrine is that it would make NOT sharing the fullness of truth with other "Christians" in their best interest. It would be best to allow them to live in all the light they know and be saved, than to present the fullness of truth, risk them rejecting it, and then have them be condemned.

I'm of the opinion that there is absolutely no assurance of salvation outside of Acts 2:38. All we can do is entrust the fate of those faithful and devout Christians who die outside of Acts 2:38 into the hands of God. He is a righteous judge and will always do what is just. May God have mercy on their souls. And I think we should leave it there.

I cannot in good conscience refer to anyone outside of Acts 2:38 and tell you that they were saved with absolute assurance. Likewise, I cannot look at you and tell you in good conscience that I know how God will judge such a one and condemn them to Hell with absolute assurance. I can only entrust their fate to God, knowing He will judge righteously.

With that said, I admonish that we preach, teach, and obey Acts 2:38 so that we can share and experience the blessed assurance of eternal salvation.

Amen bottom line!

Michael The Disciple · #9 04-13-2018, 09:43 AM

Quote:

I'm of the opinion that there is absolutely no assurance of salvation outside of Acts 2:38. All we can do is entrust the fate of those faithful and devout Christians who die outside of Acts 2:38 into the hands of God. He is a righteous judge and will always do what is just. May God have mercy on their souls. And I think we should leave it there.

Ok. Fine. But now what about people AFTER Acts 2:38? Are they given a pass because THEY MAY NOT UNDERSTAND BIBLICAL TRUTH? Is Jesus ok with us coming together all with different views of his truth?

Will he look out among the Pre tribs, Preterists and immortal soul adherents and say "I know my word was to hard to understand and really it was not even important anyway! So because you were baptized in Jesus name, even tho you spurned a lot of my truth the kingdom is ALL YOURS!

See the point? Apostolics cut themselves an eternal break when it comes to not understanding truth that they wont allow for anyone else.

Originalist · #10 04-13-2018, 10:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Ok. Fine. But now what about people AFTER Acts 2:38? Are they given a pass because THEY MAY NOT UNDERSTAND BIBLICAL TRUTH? Is Jesus ok with us coming together all with different views of his truth?

Will he look out among the Pre tribs, Preterists and immortal soul adherents and say "I know my word was to hard to understand and really it was not even important anyway! So because you were baptized in Jesus name, even tho you spurned a lot of my truth the kingdom is ALL YOURS!

See the point? Apostolics cut themselves an eternal break when it comes to not understanding truth that they wont allow for anyone else.

What about those who don't claim to know the answers to all of these questions but continue to seek God while leaving it all in his hands? Some die truly not being convinced 100 % on where they stood on some of the issues you mention. Do they then de lost?