Trumpcare

[jfrog]

I am hearing promises that Trump will keep the preexisting conditions mandate of Obamacare.

It is this mandate that is the biggest problem with Obamacare. This mandate was to be kept in check with the insurance tax to force people to buy insurance.

If the preexisting condition mandate is kept as law but its support mechanism is dropped then this will only accelerate the destruction of health insurance as we know it.

The reason for this is that you cannot guarantee insurance to people that are costly to insure without raising the price of insurance. A higher cost on insurance lowers the number of healthy uncostly people that will take insurance. It's a feedback loop that ends in the destruction of health insurance as it's currently known.

I believe this is planned by Trump and or his advisors. It's to usher in catastrophic health insurance and health savings plans. I'm not sure I'm prepared for such a plan, but I'm not sure it would be a bad thing.

[aegsm76]

In some regards, I differ from my conservative compatriots on health insurance.
I believe that health insurance should be available, on an "affordable" level to every citizen.
I also believe that the government should be totally out of the healthcare business, except for paying a portion of the coverage for every citizen that opts to take insurance.
This would eliminate the artificial price controls put in place on medical expenses and let the market control the supply and demand.
Much more I could say here, as I have spent many years in different aspects of the healthcare field.

[n david]

Originally Posted by aegsm76

In some regards, I differ from my conservative compatriots on health insurance.
I believe that health insurance should be available, on an "affordable" level to every citizen.
I also believe that the government should be totally out of the healthcare business, except for paying a portion of the coverage for every citizen that opts to take insurance.
This would eliminate the artificial price controls put in place on medical expenses and let the market control the supply and demand.
Much more I could say here, as I have spent many years in different aspects of the healthcare field.

Would it be wrong to say you like obamacare, but believe it should be more affordable?

[aegsm76]

Originally Posted by n david

Would it be wrong to say you like obamacare, but believe it should be more affordable?

No, I do not like Obamacare, because it made the government more involved in healthcare.
I want the government out of healthcare, including medicare/medicaid, the only involvement the government should have is to pay X for everyone that signs up for healthcare.

[n david]

Originally Posted by aegsm76

No, I do not like Obamacare, because it made the government more involved in healthcare.
I want the government out of healthcare, including medicare/medicaid, the only involvement the government should have is to pay X for everyone that signs up for healthcare.

Thanks.

If the government is paying for something, shouldn't it be able to control what it is paying? This is the issue with the government being involved at all. Even if you want its role to be simply a payer, it would undoubtedly demand more involvement because of being a payer.

[jfrog]

Originally Posted by n david

Thanks.

If the government is paying for something, shouldn't it be able to control what it is paying? This is the issue with the government being involved at all. Even if you want its role to be simply a payer, it would undoubtedly demand more involvement because of being a payer.

I don't think so. The government paying would create a minimum threshold of care determined by the market. If the government wants to increase that minimum threshold then they increase how much they pay. However, there would also be much better plans than the minimum that could be purchased for additional money.

I actually like the idea of a minimum voucher for insurance. However, you still cant use that to do away with medicare and Medicaid because those programs function not just to provide "insurance" but to pay the costs of all the procedures as well.

That's a totally different ball game.

[jfrog]

Originally Posted by aegsm76

In some regards, I differ from my conservative compatriots on health insurance.
I believe that health insurance should be available, on an "affordable" level to every citizen.
I also believe that the government should be totally out of the healthcare business, except for paying a portion of the coverage for every citizen that opts to take insurance.
This would eliminate the artificial price controls put in place on medical expenses and let the market control the supply and demand.
Much more I could say here, as I have spent many years in different aspects of the healthcare field.

Health insurance should be available and affordable. But you are not explaining how health insurance can ever be available and affordable when expensive preexisting conditions must be covered.

I believe insurance should be affordable both to the people and the companies. It takes both. It's a partnership.

[aegsm76]

Originally Posted by jfrog

Health insurance should be available and affordable. But you are not explaining how health insurance can ever be available and affordable when expensive preexisting conditions must be covered.

I believe insurance should be affordable both to the people and the companies. It takes both. It's a partnership.

jf - health insurance/coverage should be separated from companies/employment. About 13 years ago I was part of a group that did an in-depth study of this, for my company. At that time, we determined that healthcare costs would continue to rise, with no end in sight. This is because the government essentially has price controls built into their costs. So, this is inflating the true cost of healthcare to everyone else. They are also involved in stifling competition in the healthcare field, which drives the cost up.

[jfrog]

Originally Posted by aegsm76

jf - health insurance/coverage should be separated from companies/employment. About 13 years ago I was part of a group that did an in-depth study of this, for my company. At that time, we determined that healthcare costs would continue to rise, with no end in sight. This is because the government essentially has price controls built into their costs. So, this is inflating the true cost of healthcare to everyone else. They are also involved in stifling competition in the healthcare field, which drives the cost up.

Even shifting a system from employer sponsored healthcare to a more free market buy your own health insurance could cause health insurance to be more expensive.

Did you consider after tax dollars to potentially tax free dollars.
Did you consider that people who work may be generally healthier than people who do not?
Did you consider that Medicaid and Medicare pay far more than uninsured people do?
Did you consider what would happen without government price controls and oversight?

There's many other questions that can be asked as well. But suffice it to say that the issue is very complex. I get that. Most talk is about moving eggs from one basket to another and calling it fixed.

I believe transparency in cost is a big issue. I should know what I will pay before anything is done.

I believe there should be competition. I'm for keeping employer sponsored insurance. It's a form of competition. I'm also for having non employer sponsored health insurance opportunities. The more options the better.

So how is the health care system fixed. A lot needs to change on every level from how doctors offices and hospitals operate to how drug companies operate to how insurance works.

[Amanah]

the preexisting condition mandate can be kept in the plan, but it will have an additional cost then for people who don't have a preexisting condition.