Angels and their ability to sin

[Nu-Texan]

I have been taught all my life that the Angels are basically robots with no free will and were created to worship GOD with no ability to sin. However, we do have the example of Lucifer and the 1/3 of the Angels CHOOSING to rebel against GOD and thus being thrown out of Heaven. So does that mean angels have free will also?

[shawndell]

Angels dont have forgiveness extended to them as we do so they can choose to sin but then they cant come back to the father.Angels have higher knowledge than we do and we got tricked in the garden of Eden.I think the angels would have known what they were doing when they rebelled.Now I could be wrong. So take this with a grain of salt.LOL!!

[deltaguitar]

I don't think anyone really knows.

[Nu-Texan]

The bottom line question - (re-phrased) - Do you believe angels have free will or not? and why?

[Sam]

Originally Posted by Nu-Texan

The bottom line question - (re-phrased) - Do you believe angels have free will or not? and why?

OK, I'm not sure but they must have some free will because some of them rebelled against God.

[Falla39]

Originally Posted by Sam

OK, I'm not sure but they must have some free will because some of them rebelled against God.

Sounds like humans to me!:

[mfblume]

It is inconclusive to say 1/3 of the angels fell. We read in Rev 12 that 1/3 of the stars were thrown down by the dragon's tail, but we are not told WHEN that occurred, neither are we told they are heavenly angels. Just stars. Stars in Rev 1 were angels of the churches.

But we do read that angels lost their first estate. That can only mean they have free will. We do not know WHEN they fell or WHY. Jude only mentioned they did. And that implies lack of faithfulness.

Jude 1:6 KJV And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.


Tradition alone says 1/3 of the stars falling means heavenly angels. It is only conjecture.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by mfblume

It is inconclusive to say 1/3 of the angels fell. We read in Rev 12 that 1/3 of the stars were thrown down by the dragon's tail, but we are not told WHEN that occurred, neither are we told they are heavenly angels. Just stars. Stars in Rev 1 were angels of the churches.

But we do read that angels lost their first estate. That can only mean they have free will. We do not know WHEN they fell or WHY. Jude only mentioned they did. And that implies lack of faithfulness.

Jude 1:6 KJV And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.


Tradition alone says 1/3 of the stars falling means heavenly angels. It is only conjecture.

I don't think it's tradition. There seems to be biblical evidence the stars are angels, as you mentioned

Rev 1:20 The mystery of the seven stars that you saw in my right hand and the seven golden lampstands is this: The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches and the seven lampstands are the seven churches.

Dan 8:10 It grew so big it reached the army of heaven, and it brought about the fall of some of the army and some of the stars to the ground, where it trampled them.

Army....the Host of heaven.

1Ki 22:19 And he said, Hear thou therefore the word of the LORD: I saw the LORD sitting on his throne, and all the host of heaven standing by him on his right hand and on his left.

Host
tsaw-baw', tseb-aw-aw'
From H6633; a mass of persons (or figurative things), especially regularly organized for war (an army); by implication a campaign, literally or figuratively (specifically hardship, worship): - appointed time, (+) army, (+) battle, company, host, service, soldiers, waiting upon, war (-fare).

Job 38:7 when the morning stars sang together and all the sons of God shouted for joy?

Morning stars.

Now consider the context though

Rev 12:7 Now war arose in heaven, Michael and his angels fighting against the dragon. And the dragon and his angels fought back,
Rev 12:8 but he was defeated and there was no longer any place for them in heaven.
Rev 12:9 And the great dragon was thrown down, that ancient serpent, who is called the devil and Satan, the deceiver of the whole world--he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

I don't think it's tradition. There seems to be biblical evidence the stars are angels, as you mentioned

Rev 1:20 The mystery of the seven stars that you saw in my right hand and the seven golden lampstands is this: The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches and the seven lampstands are the seven churches.

But these angels in Rev 1 are not heavenly angels, for Jesus tells some of the angel of the churches to repent. In that case, angel is literally a messenger, as a called set preacher in a congregation.

Dan 8:10 It grew so big it reached the army of heaven, and it brought about the fall of some of the army and some of the stars to the ground, where it trampled them.

Army....the Host of heaven.

1Ki 22:19 And he said, Hear thou therefore the word of the LORD: I saw the LORD sitting on his throne, and all the host of heaven standing by him on his right hand and on his left.

Host
tsaw-baw', tseb-aw-aw'
From H6633; a mass of persons (or figurative things), especially regularly organized for war (an army); by implication a campaign, literally or figuratively (specifically hardship, worship): - appointed time, (+) army, (+) battle, company, host, service, soldiers, waiting upon, war (-fare).

Job 38:7 when the morning stars sang together and all the sons of God shouted for joy?

Morning stars.

Now consider the context though

Rev 12:7 Now war arose in heaven, Michael and his angels fighting against the dragon. And the dragon and his angels fought back,
Rev 12:8 but he was defeated and there was no longer any place for them in heaven.
Rev 12:9 And the great dragon was thrown down, that ancient serpent, who is called the devil and Satan, the deceiver of the whole world--he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him.

I think IT IS heavenly angels in Rev 12. But to say WHEN that occurred is another thing. Some say it occurred before man's creation, others say it occurred in the days of satan's downfall after the cross. Some say it has not yet occurred!

[Sister Alvear]

Who are those angels in chains?