Forsaking Jesus as a nation

[Praxeas]

I am reading WND report on the convocation for the tragic events at VT. Now I am not saying WND reports accurately and if anyone can provide a report otherwise, please do so. However they report that they had a Muslim Iman invoking the name of Allah, a Jewish Rabbi invoking "God", a Buddhist monk invoking Buddha and then a liberal Lutheran who did not mention Jesus at all but spoke generically of healing

"I'm sitting here watching the convocation service at VT," wrote a WND reader who was given anonymity. "Five minutes ago they had four representatives from the local 'religious community.' The Muslim specifically invoked Allah's blessings… and he didn't shy away from saying the name of Allah. The Jewish rep asked for God's blessings. Buddha was represented. The only name that [was] omitted, of course, Jesus Christ."


And another WND reader cited the speakers, in order:

• <LI nd="6">"1st Speaker: A Muslim cleric invoking the name of Allah and quoting the Quran."
  <LI nd="7">"2nd Speaker: A Buddhist Community Leader preaching that mankind is basically 'good.'"
  <LI nd="8">"3rd Speaker: A Female speaker from the Jewish Community quoting Ecclesiastes: 'There is a time for everything.'"
• "4th Speaker: A Liberal Lutheran Minister talking about 'healing,' etc. and how everyone needs to come together (blah, blah, blah…)."

"BUT NOT ONE EVANGELICAL CHRISTIAN PASTOR/PREACHER. NO INVOCATION OF THE NAME OF CHRIST JESUS," the reader said.

This is in no way a reflection on what happened yesterday, but I am wondering if this is true then is this a part of a larger problem? There are growing concerns it seems from other brothers and sisters that Judgement is coming to America

Isa 17:9 In that day their strong cities will be like the deserted places of the wooded heights and the hilltops, which they deserted because of the children of Israel, and there will be desolation.
Isa 17:10 For you have forgotten the God of your salvation and have not remembered the Rock of your refuge; therefore, though you plant pleasant plants and sow the vine-branch of a stranger,

Eze 22:7 Father and mother are treated with contempt in you; the sojourner suffers extortion in your midst; the fatherless and the widow are wronged in you.
Eze 22:8 You have despised my holy things and profaned my Sabbaths.
Eze 22:9 There are men in you who slander to shed blood, and people in you who eat on the mountains; they commit lewdness in your midst.
Eze 22:10 In you men uncover their fathers' nakedness; in you they violate women who are unclean in their menstrual impurity.
Eze 22:11 One commits abomination with his neighbor's wife; another lewdly defiles his daughter-in-law; another in you violates his sister, his father's daughter.
Eze 22:12 In you they take bribes to shed blood; you take interest and profit and make gain of your neighbors by extortion; but me you have forgotten, declares the Lord GOD.
Eze 22:13 "Behold, I strike my hand at the dishonest gain that you have made, and at the blood that has been in your midst.
Eze 22:14 Can your courage endure, or can your hands be strong, in the days that I shall deal with you? I the LORD have spoken, and I will do it.
Eze 22:15 I will scatter you among the nations and disperse you through the countries, and I will consume your uncleanness out of you.
Eze 22:16 And you shall be profaned by your own doing in the sight of the nations, and you shall know that I am the LORD."

Originally Posted by Praxeas

I am reading WND report on the convocation for the tragic events at VT. Now I am not saying WND reports accurately and if anyone can provide a report otherwise, please do so. However they report that they had a Muslim Iman invoking the name of Allah, a Jewish Rabbi invoking "God", a Buddhist monk invoking Buddha and then a liberal Lutheran who did not mention Jesus at all but spoke generically of healing

"I'm sitting here watching the convocation service at VT," wrote a WND reader who was given anonymity. "Five minutes ago they had four representatives from the local 'religious community.' The Muslim specifically invoked Allah's blessings… and he didn't shy away from saying the name of Allah. The Jewish rep asked for God's blessings. Buddha was represented. The only name that [was] omitted, of course, Jesus Christ."


And another WND reader cited the speakers, in order:

• <LI nd="6">"1st Speaker: A Muslim cleric invoking the name of Allah and quoting the Quran."
  <LI nd="7">"2nd Speaker: A Buddhist Community Leader preaching that mankind is basically 'good.'"
  <LI nd="8">"3rd Speaker: A Female speaker from the Jewish Community quoting Ecclesiastes: 'There is a time for everything.'"
• "4th Speaker: A Liberal Lutheran Minister talking about 'healing,' etc. and how everyone needs to come together (blah, blah, blah…)."

"BUT NOT ONE EVANGELICAL CHRISTIAN PASTOR/PREACHER. NO INVOCATION OF THE NAME OF CHRIST JESUS," the reader said.

This is in no way a reflection on what happened yesterday, but I am wondering if this is true then is this a part of a larger problem? There are growing concerns it seems from other brothers and sisters that Judgement is coming to America

Isa 17:9 In that day their strong cities will be like the deserted places of the wooded heights and the hilltops, which they deserted because of the children of Israel, and there will be desolation.
Isa 17:10 For you have forgotten the God of your salvation and have not remembered the Rock of your refuge; therefore, though you plant pleasant plants and sow the vine-branch of a stranger,

Eze 22:7 Father and mother are treated with contempt in you; the sojourner suffers extortion in your midst; the fatherless and the widow are wronged in you.
Eze 22:8 You have despised my holy things and profaned my Sabbaths.
Eze 22:9 There are men in you who slander to shed blood, and people in you who eat on the mountains; they commit lewdness in your midst.
Eze 22:10 In you men uncover their fathers' nakedness; in you they violate women who are unclean in their menstrual impurity.
Eze 22:11 One commits abomination with his neighbor's wife; another lewdly defiles his daughter-in-law; another in you violates his sister, his father's daughter.
Eze 22:12 In you they take bribes to shed blood; you take interest and profit and make gain of your neighbors by extortion; but me you have forgotten, declares the Lord GOD.
Eze 22:13 "Behold, I strike my hand at the dishonest gain that you have made, and at the blood that has been in your midst.
Eze 22:14 Can your courage endure, or can your hands be strong, in the days that I shall deal with you? I the LORD have spoken, and I will do it.
Eze 22:15 I will scatter you among the nations and disperse you through the countries, and I will consume your uncleanness out of you.
Eze 22:16 And you shall be profaned by your own doing in the sight of the nations, and you shall know that I am the LORD."

America is NOT ISRAEL: these passages do not apply. It is heresy to try to apply God's judgments on the nation of Israel to America or any other Gentile nation.

[Ron]

Originally Posted by Chan

America is NOT ISRAEL: these passages do not apply. It is heresy to try to apply God's judgments on the nation of Israel to America or any other Gentile nation.

True Chancellor. America, Canada, or any other nation is not Israel.

So do you think that God will give us a pass?

Originally Posted by Ron

True Chancellor. America, Canada, or any other nation is not Israel.

So do you think that God will give us a pass?

I think that in the present dispensation, God's emphasis is on individuals. While there is a judgment of the nations that will occur following the battle of Armageddon at the end of Daniel's 70th week, this has nothing to do with whether a nation has a covenant relationship with God (only Israel has such a covenant relationship).

[Ron]

Originally Posted by Chan

I think that in the present dispensation, God's emphasis is on individuals. While there is a judgment of the nations that will occur following the battle of Armageddon at the end of Daniel's 70th week, this has nothing to do with whether a nation has a covenant relationship with God (only Israel has such a covenant relationship).

Neither did Sodom & Gomorrah, or Nineveh, have a covenant relationship.
The Bible says that Sodom & Gomorrah are "exsamples" unto us.

Originally Posted by Ron

Neither did Sodom & Gomorrah, or Nineveh, have a covenant relationship.
The Bible says that Sodom & Gomorrah are "exsamples" unto us.

Does it say that? Or does it say that the events in the Old Testament serve as examples for us? (As Christians, not as this or that nation; of course, the Christian's "nation," "ethnicity," and "culture" are the kingdom of Heaven).

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Chan

America is NOT ISRAEL: these passages do not apply. It is heresy to try to apply God's judgments on the nation of Israel to America or any other Gentile nation.

I did not say America was Israel NOR did I say these verses specifically apply to America. I quoted them to show that God can and does forsake nations and why he forsakes them.

Originally Posted by Praxeas

I did not say America was Israel NOR did I say these verses specifically apply to America. I quoted them to show that God can and does forsake nations and why he forsakes them.

Context is everything! You quoted those verses immediately after you said "There are growing concerns it seems from other brothers and sisters that Judgement is coming to America." Thus, you connected those passages to judgment coming to America.

[BrotherEastman]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

I did not say America was Israel NOR did I say these verses specifically apply to America. I quoted them to show that God can and does forsake nations and why he forsakes them.

Good point Prax.

[RevDWW]

Originally Posted by Chan

America is NOT ISRAEL: these passages do not apply. It is heresy to try to apply God's judgments on the nation of Israel to America or any other Gentile nation.

No application? Heresy?
Isn't the Old Testament types and shadows of the New?