Praying People Through

[staysharp]

So, my new Apostolic Magazine comes in the mail and here is this article on "how to pray people through". An interview with a hot shot praying people through evangelist. He says he has a 95% success rate...how does he know his success rate? Is there someone counting those who get it and those who don't and then do the math for him?

A few interesting quotes;

"People need to relax...they will not get the Holy Ghost while being uptight".

Question: If you pray with someone for a while and they seem to be getting nowhere, what do you do?

Answer: If people seem to struggle, they may not have fully repented, so I make sure they confess their sins and get it all out.

Now my question to you all: Where does it say you have to repent to receive the gift of tongues? And did not Jesus say..."how much more will your heavenly father give the Holy Spirit to those who ask"

How much repenting would one need to do to speak in tongues and get it all out? And is repentance a requisite to receiving the gifts? Are not the gifts given without repentance

Romans 11:29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.

If his gifts are irrevocable, how can one ever repent enough to merit receiving?

[mizpeh]

Do you really believe God will give the gift of the Holy Spirit to someone who hasn't turned from their sins (repented)?

[TRFrance]

Originally Posted by mizpeh

Do you really believe God will give the gift of the Holy Spirit to someone who hasn't turned from their sins (repented)?

Thank you.
And doesnt Acts 2:38 let us know that repentance is what God expects from us before baptism and the Holy Ghost?

Are we going to go running around telling folk now they can get the Holy Ghost without repentance? What bible do people see this stuff in?

[MrsMcD]

Originally Posted by mizpeh

Do you really believe God will give the gift of the Holy Spirit to someone who hasn't turned from their sins (repented)?

No

[TRFrance]

Originally Posted by staysharp

Now my question to you all: Where does it say you have to repent to receive the gift of tongues? And did not Jesus say..."how much more will your heavenly father give the Holy Spirit to those who ask"

How much repenting would one need to do to speak in tongues and get it all out? And is repentance a requisite to receiving the gifts? Are not the gifts given without repentance

Romans 11:29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.

If his gifts are irrevocable, how can one ever repent enough to merit receiving?

(Amazing...)
You seem to be implying that we receive the gifts without repentance.
That is NOT what that verse means.
It means god gives them to us without revoking them.
You might want to study that more closely, maybe with the help of a modern english version, like maybe the NIV or NASB.

29for God's gifts and his call are irrevocable. (NIV)
29for the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. (NASB)

[staysharp]

Originally Posted by TRFrance

(Amazing...)

That is NOT what that verse means.
You might want to study that more closely, maybe with the help of a modern english version, like maybe the NIV or NASB.

29for God's gifts and his call are irrevocable. (NIV)
29for the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. (NASB)

You may want to actually read what I wrote before you accuse me of falsely interpreting the bible...here is my final sentence..."
If his gifts are irrevocable, how can one ever repent enough to merit receiving?

Now instead of attacking me, why don't you answer the question?

[TRFrance]

Originally Posted by staysharp

You may want to actually read what I wrote before you accuse me of falsely interpreting the bible...here is my final sentence..."
If his gifts are irrevocable, how can one ever repent enough to merit receiving?

Now instead of attacking me, why don't you answer the question?

Calm yourself down a bit. Nobody's attacking you, bro.
You did appear to be incorrectly interpreting the verse. No one accused you of falsely interpreting it. Big difference.

(Your post isn't very clear, in some spots, in case you had't noticed. Better clarity helps prevent people from misunderstand what you're trying to say. )

I did go back and see what you said, and so I also modified my post a bit.
And yes I did see that last sentence. But what got my attention also was this part:

"How much repenting would one need to do to speak in tongues and get it all out? And is repentance a requisite to receiving the gifts?"

... which, as I said, seems to question whether repentence is requred on the part of the person receiving the gifts. I'll ask you then. Why wouldnt it be?

Another thing that's not clear, feel free to clear this part up... are you referrintg to the gift of the Holy Ghost, or the gift of tongues? (It's not clear if you consider them to be two different things. )

[staysharp]

Originally Posted by TRFrance

Calm yourself down a bit. Nobody's attacking you, bro.
You did appear to be incorrectly interpreting the verse. No one accused you of falsely interpreting it. Big difference.

(Your post isn't very clear, in some spots, in case you had't noticed. Better clarity helps prevent people from misunderstand what you're trying to say. )

I did go back and see what you said, and so I also modified my post a bit.
And yes I did see that last sentence. But what got my attention also was this part:

"How much repenting would one need to do to speak in tongues and get it all out? And is repentance a requisite to receiving the gifts?"

... which, as I said, seems to question whether repentence is requred on the part of the person receiving the gifts. I'll ask you then. Why wouldnt it be?

Another thing that's not clear, feel free to clear this part up... are you referrintg to the gift of the Holy Ghost, or the gift of tongues? (It's not clear if you consider them to be two different things. )

Well, IMO (which is another debate entirely) there isn't but one gift. The gift of tongues according to I Cor 12. What the Apostles received in Acts 2 was the ability to communicate in another language to those who were standing by so they could hear the marvelous works of God in their native tongue. We simply do not have any other examples of a separate work.

I believe in receiving the Holy Spirit, but not as typical modern Pentecostalism proposes. The Holy Spirit is given to those who ask. If any man thirsts, let him drink...freely. Jesus is free.

I believe in turning from sin towards Christ, but one simply cannot make the case that God is a respecter of persons and one need labor for a gift. A gift is a gift. It's what he does for us, independent of who we are.

[TRFrance]

Originally Posted by staysharp

Well, IMO (which is another debate entirely) there isn't but one gift. The gift of tongues according to I Cor 12. What the Apostles received in Acts 2 was the ability to communicate in another language to those who were standing by so they could hear the marvelous works of God in their native tongue. We simply do not have any other examples of a separate work.

I believe in receiving the Holy Spirit, but not as typical modern Pentecostalism proposes. The Holy Spirit is given to those who ask. If any man thirsts, let him drink...freely. Jesus is free.

I believe in turning from sin towards Christ, but one simply cannot make the case that God is a respecter of persons and one need labor for a gift. A gift is a gift. It's what he does for us, independent of who we are.

You're right... it is another debate for another time.

Secondly, tongues in the New Testament is not limited to the Acts 2 example you used... that is, being:

"the ability to communicate in another language to those who were standing by so they could hear the marvelous works of God in their native tongue."

When you take a good look at what Paul says in 1 Cor 14 you'll see that.

But if you dont mind me asking... do you/have you ever received the gift of the Holy Ghost speaking with tongues? (I'm just trying to see what your personal perspective is regarding this issue.)

[freeatlast]

We should just look in the bible to find examples of how the early church prayed sinners through to speaking in tongues.

You will find nothing that remotely resembles what we All DO in our altar services in the bible.