Is This an Attempt to Control Your Pulpit?

[CC1]

I have seen the flip side of this dilemma in the independent churches I have attended the last 24 years.

When there are no vetting procedures in place for the pulpit then independent pastors are dependent upon the good word of mouth regarding minhistries they are personally not familiar with.

The vast majority of the time this works out just fine but on the rare occasion less than reputable people get recommended and end up behind the pulpit.

[HeavenlyOne]

Originally Posted by Pastor Poster

Sherri, on two different occasions (last year) I received calls from District officials asking me to cancel speaking engagements at Independent works in another state. The meetings were advertised with my name on them and UPC pastors complained that my presence would draw saints from their churches.

I laughed so hard I almost cried. I am a nobody. Most folks wouldn't come to hear me if I paid them to!

I would. And you wouldn't have to pay me that much!

I'm glad to see you back here.

[triumphant1]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

I'm saying the processes that are being proposed and instituted have similarities to those in organized crime and corporate America during the age of Robber Barons... A simple-minded observation and opinion, perhaps.

DA...what you may not be understanding here is that there are no new processes being propsed here...the only change that I can tell is the definitions that clearly define what they have meant by "under question" and "unbecoming conduct"...

[SDG]

T1 ... I'm cognizant of what happened to you in your specific district ... but you would have to acknowledge that this may not have been the modus operandi in every district .... a resolution like this would make it the order of business for all of them and open up the reasons for disfellowship to more subjective parameters beyond just violating the articles.

Dude, you were wronged ... I've seen it w/ my own eyes ... Dad was a Presbyter on the NYMD board... even he was disgusted at how the processes are becoming less and less forth right .... one of the last things he did was write a half-legible letter that described his concerns .... never was delivered but trust me .... I know what shenanigans are out there. Dad did discuss some of them in a district meeting weeks before going Home ... even moral issues are becoming SUBJECTIVE to the will and decisions of the boards.

[HeavenlyOne]

Originally Posted by BoredOutOfMyMind

Same stats as for Architects and Nurses.

Young people are not going for white collar jobs it seems.

Just to clarify......

The nursing shortage isn't because young people aren't wanting to get into the field, but the burnout rate is quite high, and by middle age, they are taking lower paying jobs and getting out of the nursing field.

Where I live, there is no nursing shortage. It's difficult to get a job as a nurse.

[SDG]

T1, according to PP this is an addendum to the existing resolution ... perhaps it was already being practiced in many or some places ...

(a) The term "under question" shall be taken to mean a formal decision by a District Board reflecting a concern that conduct in flagrant violation of the Manual of the United Pentecostal Church International has occurred.

[triumphant1]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

T1 ... I'm cognizant of what happened to you in your specific district ... but you would have to acknowledge that this may not have been the modus operandi in every district .... a resolution like this would make it the order of business for all of them and open up the reasons for disfellowship for more subjective parameters beyond just violating the articles.

Dude, you were wronged ... I've seen it w/ my own eyes ... Dad was a Presbyter on the NYMD ... even he was disgusted at how the processes are becoming less and less forth right .... one of the last things he did was write a half-legible letter that described his concerns .... never was delivered but trust me .... I know what shenanigans are out there.

Perhaps it is not the mode of operation in some Districts...but the "under question" guideline has been used heavily in several I am aquainted with for years...

I guess what I am trying to say is that this article has been in the manual for decades...only without the new definitions clarifying what is under quetsion and what is unbecomeing behavior...probably because so many are leaving "under question" that have not committed any offense to speak of...they just want out...like me...

Most of the time, those who have not educated themselves on the difference between these two terms automatically assume that if a man goes out "under question" there is something morally wrong in his life........under question=adultery

So it would appear that they are trying to clarify...

If a guy get booted out under question....its a doctrine thing...

If a guy gets booted out with "unbecoming conduct" it is a moral thing...

Makes me wonder if some district out there is getting sued by some guy who was put out under question and now has 400 rumers out about his morality...when in fact he just wanted out and they just didn't want some UPC guys preaching for him....

[triumphant1]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

T1, according to PP this is an addendum to the existing resolution ... perhaps it was already being practiced in many or some places ...

That's what I'm trying to clarify...the resolution has been in the manual for decades...this resolution simply defines the terms they have been using for years...

[Steve Epley]

Back in the formation of the AMF the UPC was taking men's license illegally according to the manual then placing their names with the guys had their license pulled for committing adultery. Elder Burr said his name was between 2 adulterers. That was 40 years ago nothing new. The District Supts. made it up as they went.

[triumphant1]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

T1, according to PP this is an addendum to the existing resolution ... perhaps it was already being practiced in many or some places ...

LOL...BTW...as for me there was no flagrant violation of anything...but I am doomed forever "under question".....that is the final word about me in my UPC file at headquarters....