Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.
Defining what happened in the above Scripture is troubling. What we have, in modern terms, is mass genocide justified by God’s Authority, the prophet Samuel.
Many problems exist in drawing parallels to what is expected of people who claim God as loving, patient, kind, and a Gospel (Good News) that James says; But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy. And the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace of them that make peace.
Doing something like this today would draw Christians into outrage, because of how most feel about abortion, abuse of women, and compassion on innocent children.
Imagine, going into a city of human beings, where people are living with their families, abiding in the hope for another day, swords drawn, slaughtering a mother and her infant as she screams for mercy. People are people, no matter where we live, and cultures don’t separate the fact, we love our children, wives, husbands, grandparents, animals, even in situations where the poor and no so fortunate are born.
I thought we as God’s people are not supposed to kill. That we are to love our enemies; That we are to pray for those who despitefully use us; That blessed are the merciful, for they shall obtain mercy; That we are to forgive, seventy times seven; That if we don’t forgive the begging servant who owes us, our Father in Heaven won’t forgive us; That we are to forgive those who trespass against us; That we are to turn the other cheek. That Blessed are the peacemakers.
Father forgive them, for they know not what they do.
One main reason something like this took place with no protest was no access to large scale media, the secrecy of this atrocity kept quiet and out of touch by lack of graphic display to the everyday person. Imagine turning on your TV, or going to Youtube, watching actual footage of men slaughtering babies, mothers, animals, and the elderly.
Today, if we claimed God told us by the Prophet of God to go into Mexico City, San Francisco, Paris, killing every living, breathing human being and animal in the name of righteousness, the Church would go fanatical with insult. Look what happened during the Vietnam War, when the American people saw the atrocities there by some of our military.
How about Rwanda, Darfur, Bosnia, and the Holocaust?
Yet somehow, we continue our strange attraction to events like this, preaching to the church about the rebellion of Saul. No worry to further instill fear in people, Samuel takes care of the final act by severing the King of Amalek into pieces in front of everybody. Do we call this humane? An act of God?
If we couldn’t do it, why should others do it, and why should we justify it? I honestly don’t see how this correlates to the Loving God we portray today in the Christian movement. I guess we still do what people have always done; Use what fits, and do whatever it takes to make it work, even if we must suppress them by FEAR!
Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.
Defining what happened in the above Scripture is troubling. What we have, in modern terms, is mass genocide justified by God’s Authority, the prophet Samuel.
Many problems exist in drawing parallels to what is expected of people who claim God as loving, patient, kind, and a Gospel (Good News) that James says; But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy. And the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace of them that make peace.
Doing something like this today would draw Christians into outrage, because of how most feel about abortion, abuse of women, and compassion on innocent children.
Imagine, going into a city of human beings, where people are living with their families, abiding in the hope for another day, swords drawn, slaughtering a mother and her infant as she screams for mercy. People are people, no matter where we live, and cultures don’t separate the fact, we love our children, wives, husbands, grandparents, animals, even in situations where the poor and no so fortunate are born.
I thought we as God’s people are not supposed to kill. That we are to love our enemies; That we are to pray for those who despitefully use us; That blessed are the merciful, for they shall obtain mercy; That we are to forgive, seventy times seven; That if we don’t forgive the begging servant who owes us, our Father in Heaven won’t forgive us; That we are to forgive those who trespass against us; That we are to turn the other cheek. That Blessed are the peacemakers.
Father forgive them, for they know not what they do.
One main reason something like this took place with no protest was no access to large scale media, the secrecy of this atrocity kept quiet and out of touch by lack of graphic display to the everyday person. Imagine turning on your TV, or going to Youtube, watching actual footage of men slaughtering babies, mothers, animals, and the elderly.
Today, if we claimed God told us by the Prophet of God to go into Mexico City, San Francisco, Paris, killing every living, breathing human being and animal in the name of righteousness, the Church would go fanatical with insult. Look what happened during the Vietnam War, when the American people saw the atrocities there by some of our military.
How about Rwanda, Darfur, Bosnia, and the Holocaust?
Yet somehow, we continue our strange attraction to events like this, preaching to the church about the rebellion of Saul. No worry to further instill fear in people, Samuel takes care of the final act by severing the King of Amalek into pieces in front of everybody. Do we call this humane? An act of God?
If we couldn’t do it, why should others do it, and why should we justify it? I honestly don’t see how this correlates to the Loving God we portray today in the Christian movement. I guess we still do what people have always done; Use what fits, and do whatever it takes to make it work, even if we must suppress them by FEAR!
Oh, but God loves them.......??????
Only thing that comes to mind is God's ways are not ours?I've wondered about this too.God in the old testament don't seen to be like Jesus.This is example only; We are fighting a war on terror but where does it stop.There are some who train up a terrorist from the crib and they have been taught they do service to Allah by killing the infidels.
Maybe these we read about in the Old Testament like the Ammonites and the Hittites and all the other tites was a situation of getting rid of necessary evil or kill or be killed.The survival of God's chosen people probably depended on getting rid of Heathen tribes.Most of these tribes passed their babies through the fire in a worship of a strange God when in fact they were worshipping Satan(SAME THING)
__________________ John 14:16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Counsellor to be with you for ever 17 The Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you.
1 Kings 20:35 And a certain man of the sons of the prophets said unto his neighbour in the word of the LORD, Smite me, I pray thee. And the man refused to smite him. 36 Then said he unto him, Because thou hast not obeyed the voice of the LORD, behold, as soon as thou art departed from me, a lion shall slay thee. And as soon as he was departed from him, a lion found him, and slew him.
This poor guy was ordered by God to kill a prophet of God. What a predicament! What would you do, in his shoes? Well, the guy was disobedient. Downright evil, perhaps. That's what disobeying God makes you, isn't it? God must have thought so, so He killed that evil man.
__________________
Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
What we call the 6th commandment, "Thou shalt not kill" was quoted by Jesus as "Thou shalt do no murder" in Matthew 19:18.
YHWH made a difference between murder and the taking of life in battle or in capital punishment. God set up provisions for punishing someone who murdered someone else by instituting capital punishment before the law of Moses in Genesis 9:5-6. In the law of Moses capital punishment was to be administered for certain crimes such as murder, adultery, witchcraft, etc. The Apostle Paul reiterates the divine right for government to take a person's life as punishment in some cases in Romans 13:1-8.
One of the ways God has punished people in the past is by killing them. He did this to individuals and to groups. He did this in Noah's day by sending a flood. He did it in Exodus chapter 12 by killing the firstborn in every home that did not have the blood applied to the doorposts. And He did it through Israel to the people who lived in Canaan. Today we would call the way Israel conquered Canaan genocide or ethnic cleansing but it was the way God brought judgment upon them. Later, God brought judgment upon Israel through Babylon. We see that in the book of Habakkuk. This was under the Old Covenant. Under the New Covenant we are not commanded to kill off people to carry out the judgment of God.
What we call the 6th commandment, "Thou shalt not kill" was quoted by Jesus as "Thou shalt do no murder" in Matthew 19:18.
YHWH made a difference between murder and the taking of life in battle or in capital punishment. God set up provisions for punishing someone who murdered someone else by instituting capital punishment before the law of Moses in Genesis 9:5-6. In the law of Moses capital punishment was to be administered for certain crimes such as murder, adultery, witchcraft, etc. The Apostle Paul reiterates the divine right for government to take a person's life as punishment in some cases in Romans 13:1-8.
One of the ways God has punished people in the past is by killing them. He did this to individuals and to groups. He did this in Noah's day by sending a flood. He did it in Exodus chapter 12 by killing the firstborn in every home that did not have the blood applied to the doorposts. And He did it through Israel to the people who lived in Canaan. Today we would call the way Israel conquered Canaan genocide or ethnic cleansing but it was the way God brought judgment upon them. Later, God brought judgment upon Israel through Babylon. We see that in the book of Habakkuk. This was under the Old Covenant. Under the New Covenant we are not commanded to kill off people to carry out the judgment of God.
Would you kill a baby, a woman, or an elderly person with a sword, in the name of Jehovah if they were pleading for mercy, regardless of what time frame we are in?
Would you kill a baby, a woman, or an elderly person with a sword, in the name of Jehovah if they were pleading for mercy, regardless of what time frame we are in?
I would not in 2009.
If I were an Israelite in 1405 BC I would have to in order to obey YHWH.
I would not in 2009.
If I were an Israelite in 1405 BC I would have to in order to obey YHWH.
And I suppose you would have your own son killed if he was disobedient? (Back then, I mean!)
And you would have obeyed God and captured the Mideanite little girls, and killed the male babies, kids, and adults (and the non-virgin ladies), if you had been in the good guys' army?
__________________
Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
I would not in 2009.
If I were an Israelite in 1405 BC I would have to in order to obey YHWH.
Not only Religion in its darkest form, but total contradiction of Old and New Testaments. According to you, God has changed.
Killing innocent people is murder, and a God who condones this will always confuse His creation.
Why are we so willing to accept something we haven't done?? Have you killed babies, women, or an old man or woman who can't move from a bed of affliction?
Your coldness towards this issue troubles me deeply.
Not only Religion in its darkest form, but total contradiction of Old and New Testaments. According to you, God has changed.
Killing innocent people is murder, and a God who condones this will always confuse His creation.
Why are we so willing to accept something we haven't done?? Have you killed babies, women, or an old man or woman who can't move from a bed of affliction?
Your coldness towards this issue troubles me deeply.
You are judging God, NFS.
If God chooses to use the sword, famine, pestilence, or whatever He desires to punish a nation or an individual for sin (Eze 14:21), that is His choice. It is His creation, the work of His hands. He can do with it as He wishes. God gave Israel specific instructions when they were to take the land of promise and He gave them the reasons why they were to destroy everyone in the land. God gave Israel a law and the reasons for those laws.
I can only guess what you think of God striking Ananias and Sapphira dead when they lied to Him.
__________________
His banner over me is LOVE.... My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?
To be a servant of God, it will cost us our total commitment to God, and God alone. His burden must be our burden... Sis Alvear
John 14:16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Counsellor to be with you for ever 17 The Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you.
My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. 
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