Quote:
Originally Posted by mfblume
I already quoted James in saying the body is "dead" without the spirit. James distinctly says the BODY and identifies that which died as the BODY in association with dead And I already quoted 2 Cor 5:8 to show souls do go to heaven without the body at death. You have to take my explanation and take the verse and show why I am wrong about it in order to convince me you are correct. |
Nobody is saying that the body is alive without the spirit. But you are implying ONLY the body is dead without the spirit.
Scripture speaks of the dead as being the people that are dead, not JUST their bodies.
Flesh was animated by spirit, and the result was "a living soul". The soul was not alive until flesh was joined with spirit. When spirit and flesh are separated, the PERSON dies, and is no longer a LIVING SOUL.
In
1 Cor 15, Paul treats extensively of the subject of resurrection, and not once does he mention any intermediate state of disembodied consciousness in heaven. His teaching is not JUST about the raising of the body, but of the PERSON. in fact, his point has to do with hope. He says if the dead are not raised, we have no hope and are still in our sins.
But this is untrue, IF conscious bliss in heaven in a disembodied intermediate state is correct. If dying and going to heaven is real (prior to resurrection), then a lack of resurrection wouldn't be so bad. As I stated before, the vast majority of Christians expect to die and go to heaven. Most don't even think about any actual bodily resurrection.
But Paul clearly tied our hope, and immortality, to the resurrection. This is different than what is preached across most pulpits concerning our hope. Usually, it is "go to heaven at death". Paul had ample opportunity to mention a supposed intermediate state, but did not. When people speak and teach about hope for the dead, they do not fail to mention the intermediate state if that's what they believe.
Paul also taught that the time when we would be with the Lord is the resurrection. He does not say anywhere that we would be with the Lord BEFORE resurrection.
2 Cor 5 does not speak of being with the Lord before the resurrection, that is an assumption imported into the actual text. He said his expectation and desire is to be out of the mortal body and IN THE RESURRECTION BODY. So when he then afterward speaks of being absent from the body, and present with the Lord,
he is speaking of the same thing, not introducing a NEW subject.
Where does Paul EXPLICITLY teach a conscious intermediate state? Nowhere.