[Aquila]

Originally Posted by good samaritan

Idolatry is a sin of course, but I don't see where De 22:5 associates idolatry with a woman not wearing male garments and visa versa. We can make up some context out of thin air, but we cannot trust in a context that is not presented in the scripture itself. I like to read about history and culture in ancient days, but if the scripture does not give the context we cannot insert things from history and say that is what the verse is really meaning. When I read De 22:5, it is very simple, God don't want me to wear a womans clothes and he don't want women wearing mens clothes. The question is can culture just take a garment of clothing that has always been male attire and put a female label on it and say it is now ok for women.

I totally agree. While the scholars, historians, and archeologists etc. can give us some sense of the cultural context at a given time, the verse itself references nothing involving idolatry. My angle takes what scholars say into consideration, and sees this as a very general command prohibiting cross-dressing of any kind, for any reason, idolatry included.

Prior to 1962 sodomy was a felony in the US punishable by a lengthy term of imprisonment (accodrding to wikipedia). That being said, this nation has lost their minds concerning male and female. I personally feel like the confusion in the role of father and mother in homes since the turn of the 20th century has much to do with homosexuality and transgenderism in our country today.

I wouldn't want the civil government prosecuting people for anything they choose to do in private (gay or straight) unless it endangers the life, liberty, or property of another. However, it does show how the American consciousness has evolved. We went from outlawing a thing to essentially praising it. That's a drastic change. It really shows how far we've drifted.

Historically speaking, fathers worked the fields or traveled doing business and mothers would tend the house. These roles were rather solid. There was still a lot of hanky-panky going on. In some ways, society was far more quiet about affairs, abuse, incest, etc. I don't want to over romanticize the past. And yes, homosexuality was present. It was just kept very hush-hush. One of the things I've discovered is that back in the day boys were allowed to be boys. Being a boy, being interested in girls, women, etc. was considered normal. It was part of a boy's development. However, today, almost everything is so feminized it almost seems like any male behavior, inclination, interest, or attitude is shamed. If my son was caught peeping through a neighbor's fence at the neighbor's daughter sun bathing, and I ran him into the house, but laughed with a friend saying, "Well, boys will be boys.", they'd act like I endorsed rape culture or something. In every sitcom on television the dad is portrayed as a big doofus (as in the show, Home Improvement) who couldn't find his way out of a paper bag. Half the show is trying to fix how dad tried to address the crisis. As the boys grow older in the show (for example in the show, Modern Family) they become goofy idiots like dad. It's a campaign against males, especially white males. I've had to repeatedly remind my kids that my word is law, and no, mom isn't going to fix anything you don't like. However, on the show women, girls, and even gay people are depicted as level headed, funny, witty, compassionate, etc. It's no wonder little boys grow up idolizing women and seeing femininity and homosexuality as "cool". If a man loses his cool and raises his voice, society acts like he's a wild animal who just "lost it". Dude, it's just raising one's voice. Get over it. If a man chooses to have a swimsuit poster down in his workshop, get over it. If a man enjoys fishing, camping, hunting, hiking, and the great outdoors, get over it. If he's into birdwatching, get him counseling. lol No, just joking. Seriously, we've become a society that makes it feel like being a man is somehow... wrong. Even in some churches (thank God, not all) we have boys wearing skinny jean style suits, pink and pastel shirts, slick metro haircuts, and darkened eyebrows, and reddened lips (I've still not figured out why or how the boys are making their lips look so freakin' red, it almost looks like lipstick). One church I was in had an obviously feminine music minister who talked gay, mannered his hands like he was gay, and he'd prance around dancing while leading the choir like some woman. When I asked if he was gay or had been delivered from being gay, people acted like I was weird. C'mon, it's obvious that the dude is acting tooty-fruity, I was just wanting to know what was up. Evidently, he was married and had a lovely bombshell of a wife. I hope I'm wrong, but I still have my doubts. I wouldn't be surprised if in ten years we hear he left her for another man and everyone will act like it came out of nowhere. But, my point is, his effeminate manner was embraced. There's a war against masculinity. And I think that contributes a lot to boys growing up and trying the waters of homosexuality. What little boy wants to grow up to be a man, with the way media and society views men???

Now, I know there's probably more to being gay than environmental and social influences. I'm just saying, it should be an honor to be a man. And what constitutes manhood should be respected just as much as we honor and respect womanhood.

Whether you realize it or not, small compromises lead to much harm, espeacially over generations. It is the little foxes that spoil the vines.

So very true.

Sorry for my rant above. I've just seen this garbage so many times it gets me going.