The Nonsense About How Xtians View Christ's Love.
 

Calm down. I wrote "Xtian" because the space for Thread titles is limited.

Luke 14:23, "If a man loves me, he will keep my words, and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him."

It requires little searching within The Modern Evangelical Church to hear some statement to the effect, "Jesus Loves Us Unconditionally!" But, the facts of Scripture, right here in Luke 14:23 quoting Jesus' very own Words, show that Jesus' and the Father's love is entirely conditional upon whether or not we first obey Jesus' Words and come to Him.

Old Addled Apostle John must have not said it quite right in 1John 4:19 when he wrote that Jesus "first loved us." Who should you believe? Jesus' Words, or Addled John? Remember, Jesus never said "I Love You" to anyone, not to His Mom, His Siblings, the people He healed, and certainly not to The Pharisees and Saducees. Not The Woman at the Well, not to The Syrophoenician Dog Woman, not to Mary and Martha. Jesus did mention His previous acts of love for the Disciples, in John 13:34, but He never ran around babbling, "Oh! I just love you all so much!! My love is UNCONDITIONAL for you!!" Nope. Not one time.

So, the only resolution to this shocking news for you Special Little Christian Hearts is that God did indeed first love The World as John wrote in 3:16, but only in a generic and general manner. His love for any individual person is entirely conditional, as Jesus clearly stated in Luke 14:23. Try to pray and calm down before you compulsively start tossing out weak little ad hominems. Speak to the issue here like a Real Believer.

Re: The Nonsense About How Xtians View Christ's Lo
 

Mark 10:21 Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: go thy way, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me.

John 11:3 Therefore his sisters sent unto him, saying, Lord, behold, he whom thou lovest is sick.

John 11:5 Now Jesus loved Martha, and her sister, and Lazarus.

John 11:36 Then said the Jews, Behold how he loved him!

John 13:23 Now there was leaning on Jesus' bosom one of his disciples, whom Jesus loved.

John 13:34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.

John 15:9 As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.

JOREBA - you are a liar! Your words have just been disproven by scripture. Take your blaspheming thoughts elsewhere.

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Liar.

Romans 5:8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

While we were sinners means before we come to Him and before we obey Him.

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Hmmmmmm

How long before JoRambo is banned?

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well, you never know how many troubled people JR reps, and we are called to turn away wrath with gentleness. The Est'd Church produces people like this, and (especially after a jaunt on "Ex-Christians") he is really pretty harmless, if obviously angst-ridden (no offense).

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I'm curious what issue exactly you are talking about here. Pentecostals hardly espouse the codependent Christ that you seem to be putting forward; isn't that a more Episcopal pov?

Do you really imagine that the Revelation of Christ being co-opted by the church is so hidden from all who read this? If Christ has been so fully revealed to you, one has to wonder why you are not reflecting Him, JR. As KBTW has (once again) schooled you, it seems, perhaps it might be better if you just stated your issue in general terms, recognizing that there are plenty of exceptions to it that might be represented here.

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Right. He's likely been burnt somehow somewhere.

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No way, I want to see Francis, Sean, and JoReba to have a discussion. :nod

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The three stooges. :heeheehee

http://www.geeksofdoom.com/GoD/img/2...ee_stooges.jpg

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Including the drinking.

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One of JoReba's ancestors in the Middle Ages.


http://cdn2.pu.nl/media/misc2/peasant.gif

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Thank you for demonstrating my point. All of the references you gave about Jesus loving individuals were based on heresay. Jesus Himself never said to any individual, "I love you." Jesus' associates back then simply felt Jesus loved them, but knew nothing of His love.

Here is the proof, Precious Lover of Talk. Those people could not have known Jesus had love for them because during the time of those narratives Jesus had not yet died on The Cross and risen to appear. Learn how to think, rather than just babble what you hear in church.

I love you, but just a little bit. That is because nobody can love other Christians "As Jesus Loved The Disciples," as he commanded. You need to keep sharing with me your weak little religious sounding ideas so that I can keep helping you. And, the more I help you in here the more other "ministers" and "evangelists" in this Forum will be helped by reading how I so easily correct you. They are too weak to speak directly to me, because all "ministers" and "evangelists" are weak and out of touch.

God Bless you. Keep learning and leaning on Jesus, and keep your humble mind as fresh as a little child. You do think and speak as a little child, just as Jesus wants you to.

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Don't forget, now. Jesus never spoke of the foolish "grace" Saul wrote so much about. IF Saul could not correctly preach about Grace, as you as well try to do, then certainly Saul could not understand God's Love. Certainly Saul did not understand God's Love, because he wanted all the World to know he was "the greatest of sinners," and thereby never accepted God's Forgiveness.

Saul produced your personal faith and ministry, and your need for pizza. Jesus did not produce your faith. You sing about Jesus, but you preach Saul. Don't you? Be honest now. You just quoted Saul above, instead of Jesus. You proved my previous assessment of you.

Lol.

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Why do you want me banned? If you do not forgive me, God the Father will not forgive you. Jesus your hobby of convenience and minor interest to you said exactly that in Matthew 6:14-15.

Read it. Lol.

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Hey I forgive you, but I still think you are lame.

One doesn't have anything to do with the other. :)

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Have you noticed how KBTW is bow afraid to say his own thoughts to me, and only quotes Scripture? That is what I did to him.

Lol. Monterrey, do you smoke pot still? When was the last time? Remember, God created both pot and the THC receptors in humans. Can you praise Him for that?

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Is bow afraid?

But, it seems that you still are rolling fatties.

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What does Jesus want? Remember, as a Pentecostal Evangelist you should be listening to The Holy Spirit 24/7, and not to your previous weak little gang banger ideas.

Lol. You preach Grace to people, but in here away from your church people you are easily pushed by me to the limit of your phoney Grace. You talk trash which comes from your fallen nature, not from The Holy Spirit.

¿Comprehende ... ? Si¿ ¿Non?

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Give one example of how you have used your "Sword" in the last 2-weeks. Lol. You cannot, because you have not. You are all show. All icon. Empty.

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He wants you to stay off certain websites for starters.

What do you base that on? Where do you find that bit of info? If we are consistent with your thoughts, then as Antichrist do you listen to Satan 24/7?


Gang banger? You must be psychologically projecting right now, because the only one around here you first started to stab and slab was you JoBob. :)

JoeRebar, you are the only one who is getting frazzled, and shifting into overdrive. :heeheehee

You speak Spanish?

Wonderful, any other tricks? ;)

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Great comback. :)

You sure ran out of quips in a hurry.

JoReba you aren't funny, your are a trouble maker who looks to flip people over on their heads, and then watch reactions as you giggle behind your computer screen.

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You are amusing, which of the three stooges are you? :D

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Nope. You had to be instructed by me to at least lie about forgiving me, Brother Beaner. Your gang banging is still your weakness. With your criminal record and your attitude, you have no marketable skills. You only have your banger mouth, and you live on handouts from people you have to impress at every service.

Tell me, do you ever materially demonstrate your big talk, or not? Your "Lord Jesus" materially demonstrated ALL of His talk. If you think He did not, then you do not know Him, and you cannot read Scripture with the guidance of The Holy Spirit. And, you thereby are lying to your listeners in the churches.

Time to regroup and reassess. Talk to your wife. She probably sees right through your "preaching" and loud mouth. I love you, Little Muchacho, and want you to mature beyond all of that pentecostal babbling.

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Tell us about the "trouble" you think I have conveyed. If you cannot, then you are as shallow as I thought. "Shallow" as in thin skinned, fragile, and easily offended. If you call my words here "trouble," then how will you react when you have to give your life for Christ, or when someone takes away your sandwiches?

Lol. Sandwiches. Lol.

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Apparently, you never use that "sword" you are so proud of imagining to have.

Do you have game, or just weak words and pictures? I would love to watch you bounce around in church tomorrow. Lol.

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You post as you evangrlize. Off the cuff. Jesus never said He wanted me off of certain websites for starters.

Tell us, do you follow Jesus, or just tell other people to do so? If you decline to say you follow Him, then you are denying Him, and He will deny you before The Father.

You have no valid rebuttal for that. Lol.

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That isn't Luke 14:23. This is:

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It is correct to say that we are under strict orders from the Messiah to forgive all who trespass against us.

However, the Messiah also said that if anyone should offend a humble, innocent believer, i.e. a "child", it would be better for that person to tie a millstone around their neck and throw themselves into the sea.

The point: We are required to forgive if offended, but God isn't required to forgive, especially when a person intentionally goes about offending the brethren.

Yes, He is just and faithful to forgive, but premeditated sin and the intentional practicing of iniquity keeps a person outside of that forgiveness.

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well, i am sensitive to when that is being done out of context myself, and i have to say that it is not coming across that way, wadr. I guess some OP that you respected told you something that hurt you once, and so now all OPs are evil? Or something? You surely know that direct confrontation is not the way.

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Did Jesus ever do "direct confrontation?" Lol. Here in Ameddika people try to use words which have accountability and meaning.

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What makes you class yourself as "humble and innocent?"

You are proud of your milque toast words.

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i would say that yes, Christ did, in certain cases; but none of us is Christ, and so i think He may have had some prerogative there--whenever us lesser mortals do it we just end up sounding like a hollow noise, and make others defensive, at which point all is lost.

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Yep you are definitely Moe, since it rhymes with Jo. :D

:stars :stars :stars
bouncy,_______bouncy,_______bouncy

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Actually, me thinks JoReba is Stegley. Used to post on Carm and posted on Christian Chat until she/he was banned........

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:happydance :heeheehee :heeheehee :heeheehee

Well, I'm glad I made your day... :happydance

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I know when I am intentionally being belligerent, confrontational, and antagonistic, and when it comes across in my tone, and when I am not, and it does not. And I can also receive correction in meekness if someone else takes offense with anything I post here, up to and including publicly apologizing for the sake of reconciliation.

How about you?

Can you be corrected? Can you be admonished? Can you apologize if you've hurt or offended anyone here at AFF with your posts?

Or is doing any and/or all of that just for wimmen folk?

Because you've been intentionally belligerent, confrontational, and antagonistic since you began posting her a few weeks ago, and you've been called on it more than once, and have not once received correction in meekness (a fruit of the Spirit, remember?!) and have not apologized to anyone you may have hurt or offended.

In fact, you've merely mocked and continued to antagonize and put anyone down who might have been hurt or offended by anything you've written as not manly enough (even though one person you've interacted with, KeptByTheWord, isn't even a man).

Then you further compound your infractions against the Lord by demanding, that if anyone's been offended by your posts, they are merely obligated to forgive you or go to hell, without so much as a confession from you that you're being offensive.

As far as I can tell, anyone who has been hurt or offended by you has forgiven you, and yet you haven't once offered anything in the way of an apology, which tells me you care little to nothing for the teachings of Jesus Christ, and are not truly formed in His image, or else you would care about His teachings regarding confession, repentance, forgiveness, and reconciliation, and you would model that care for His teachings by being more Christ-like.

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VS, JoReba is probably an atheist feigning as a Christian.

On another note I have never read an antagonistic or confrontational posting by you. You are very kind. :)