Apostolic Friends Forum - Hair, sleeves, pantsuits, jewelry, and makeup

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Re: Hair, sleeves, pantsuits, jewelry, and makeup

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlamingZword (Post 1557938)

KJV Exodus 3:22 But every woman shall borrow of her neighbour, and of her that sojourneth in her house, jewels of silver, and jewels of gold, and raiment: and ye shall put them upon your sons, and upon your daughters; and ye shall spoil the Egyptians.

NIV Exodus 3:22 Every woman is to ask her neighbor and any woman living in her house for articles of silver and gold and for clothing, which you will put on your sons and daughters. And so you will plunder the Egyptians."

We see here a command from God to put jewels upon the sons and daughters of the Israelites, why would God commanded such an action if Jewelry was sinful.

It would be like God saying load up a bunch of sin upon your sons and daughters.

This passage is about plundering the wealth of Egypt, not about decking themselves with jewlry for purposes of "dressing up".

Re: Hair, sleeves, pantsuits, jewelry, and makeup

Should we deck ourselves in gold and jewels at the high cost of human suffering? Should we deck ourselves with gold, and pearls, and costly array, when people are starving to death on our streets?

Quote:

Specifically, we urge jewelry manufacturers and retailers to conduct human rights due diligence in line with the UN Guiding Principles on Business and Human Rights and the OECD Due Diligence Guidance for Responsible Supply Chains of Minerals from Conflict-Affected and High-Risk Areas.
Furthermore, we urge the Responsible Jewellery Council to strengthen its standards to set a high bar for responsible sourcing practices in the industry.
Human rights risks in the jewelry supply chain

Over half of the world’s gold and about 70 percent of the world’s diamonds are used in jewelry, an industry that generates over US$300 billion in revenue annually. Mining also provides livelihoods for more than 40 million people worldwide who work in gold and diamond mines, often in the artisanal sector. Yet adverse human rights impacts, including child and forced labor, forced displacement and environmental harms remain common in mining.

Mining is one of the most dangerous sectors of work, yet an estimated 1 million children work in mining, in violation of international law.1 Child miners suffer injuries from carrying heavy loads and using sharp tools, are often exposed to dangerous chemicals including mercury, and have been killed when unstable pits collapse. Gold and diamond mining operations have also caused environmental damage that threatens people’s rights to health, water and food. Mining operations have also displaced indigenous peoples, and many companies have failed2 to secure free, prior, and informed consent before mining exploration in line with international standards

https://investorsforhumanrights.org/...0Statement.pdf
https://www.iccr.org/jewelry-supply-...-say-investors

Quote:

Is 3:1 See now, the Lord, the LORD Almighty, is about to take from Jerusalem and Judah both supply and support: all supplies of food and all supplies of water, 2 the hero and the warrior, the judge and the prophet, the diviner and the elder, 3 the captain of fifty and the man of rank, the counselor, skilled craftsman and clever enchanter. 4 “I will make mere youths their officials; children will rule over them.” 5 People will oppress each other— man against man, neighbor against neighbor. The young will rise up against the old, the nobody against the honored. 6 A man will seize one of his brothers in his father’s house, and say, “You have a cloak, you be our leader; take charge of this heap of ruins!” 7 But in that day he will cry out, “I have no remedy. I have no food or clothing in my house; do not make me the leader of the people.” 8 Jerusalem staggers, Judah is falling; their words and deeds are against the LORD, defying his glorious presence. 9 The look on their faces testifies against them; they parade their sin like Sodom; they do not hide it. Woe to them! They have brought disaster upon themselves. 10 Tell the righteous it will be well with them, for they will enjoy the fruit of their deeds. 11 Woe to the wicked! Disaster is upon them! They will be paid back for what their hands have done. 12 Youths oppress my people, women rule over them. My people, your guides lead you astray; they turn you from the path. 13 The LORD takes his place in court; he rises to judge the people. 14 The LORD enters into judgment against the elders and leaders of his people: “It is you who have ruined my vineyard; the plunder from the poor is in your houses. 15 What do you mean by crushing my people and grinding the faces of the poor?” declares the Lord, the LORD Almighty. 16 The LORD says, “The women of Zion are haughty, walking along with outstretched necks, flirting with their eyes, strutting along with swaying hips, with ornaments jingling on their ankles. 17 Therefore the Lord will bring sores on the heads of the women of Zion; the LORD will make their scalps bald.” 18 In that day the Lord will snatch away their finery: the bangles and headbands and crescent necklaces, 19 the earrings and bracelets and veils, 20 the headdresses and anklets and sashes, the perfume bottles and charms, 21 the signet rings and nose rings, 22 the fine robes and the capes and cloaks, the purses 23 and mirrors, and the linen garments and tiaras and shawls. 24 Instead of fragrance there will be a stench; instead of a sash, a rope; instead of well-dressed hair, baldness; instead of fine clothing, sackcloth; instead of beauty, branding. 25 Your men will fall by the sword, your warriors in battle. 26 The gates of Zion will lament and mourn; destitute, she will sit on the ground.

Re: Hair, sleeves, pantsuits, jewelry, and makeup

I can answer that specific question, perhaps, without risking the rhetoric.

God blesses people in the context of their culture. He does not favor me with extra wives or with an increase in livestock.

Those of us who are not poor are not sinning for having a warm house or a healthy diet. It is not wrong to have reliable cars or shoes without holes.

Some luxuries, such as the rights I was born with as an American citizen are inalienable.

Do I drive a luxury car ? No. Do I fill my closet with clothes from Beverly Hills ? No.

I choose to live a modest life. Something I learned from Kenneth Haney.

Poverty is everywhere. It tempers the choices I make. But it does not demand I embrace the lifestyle choices of impoverished citizens.

Re: Hair, sleeves, pantsuits, jewelry, and makeup

Quote:

Originally Posted by CC1 (Post 1557930)

The style of writing in Biblical days was different than that of today. Contrast was a big part of making points and that is what these verses regarding gold, etc are about.

It is saying that what makes a women's worth isn't the amount of gold, etc she wears but her character, godliness, etc. Of course old time Pentecostals equate godliness with not wearing makeup, jewelery etc but I believe the bible is talking about godliness in the sense of being just, honest, exhibiting the fruit of the spirit, etc.

Of course the christian principles of moderation and modesty always apply to anything we do.

YES:highfive

Re: Hair, sleeves, pantsuits, jewelry, and makeup

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Originally Posted by Scott Pitta (Post 1557949)

Good stuff.

A blessing from the Lord in Africa may be cattle, goats etc in the West it may be a raise. In one part of scripture He made sure the meal barrel wasted not and the cruise of oil didnt go dry.

To those who needed that oil it was blessing...it was life....to us in the US it'd be free cornbread for life.

Aren't we glad that God knows how to work a good "exchange rate" in His economy no matter the culture or location?

He took our mourning and gave us dancing...He took our sorrow and gave us joy...He took our chains and gave us freedom and He took our death and gave us LIFE!

These are blessings that bring joy and thanksgiving spoken in every tongue from every culture on every continent!

Re: Hair, sleeves, pantsuits, jewelry, and makeup

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amanah (Post 1557948)

Should we deck ourselves in gold and jewels at the high cost of human suffering? Should we deck ourselves with gold, and pearls, and costly array, when people are starving to death on our streets?

https://investorsforhumanrights.org/...0Statement.pdf
https://www.iccr.org/jewelry-supply-...-say-investors

The social justice angle is mostly a nonissue in my opinion. Gold mines are not manned by children, as a rule. Diamond mines may be. These type of issues are usually more complex than is normally portrayed by the media that reports on them. For instance I was forced to work in the garden while I was growing up. It was forced labor. Forced child labor. Sometimes I enjoyed it. Other times there were other things I would have rather been doing. But it was an education in itself and overall I believe it was a benefit to me. In some cases child labor can be better than the alternative which may be greater hunger or deeper poverty.

Re: Hair, sleeves, pantsuits, jewelry, and makeup

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amanah (Post 1557948)

As for the scripture that you post, did you notice that it refers to God’s judgement on his people? They will be ruled by women. (A judgement). They will be oppressed by youth. (Another judgement). Their food will be limited and not of a high quality. (God often used food or lack there of to curse his people or an abundance to bless them). He will take away their jewelry. (Another way of inflicting judgement on them).

Now conversely, if God wants to bless His people you can flip all of the cursing. Plenty of food, ruled by strong wise alpha males, youth that respect and defer to their elders, fine clothing . . .

Let’s see, am I leaving anything out?

Oh yes the necklaces, the bracelets and ALL the fine jewelry. This passage makes it pretty obvious that God considers jewelry a

BLESSING!!!!!!!

Re: Hair, sleeves, pantsuits, jewelry, and makeup

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Originally Posted by Scott Pitta (Post 1557949)

Congratulations on posting a thoughtful, well balanced response.

Re: Hair, sleeves, pantsuits, jewelry, and makeup

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Originally Posted by FlamingZword (Post 1557938)

Well keep reading and you will see God tells them to get rid of all of it. And then we see a type and shadow of what Peter preached about in the New Testament.