Apostolic Friends Forum
Page 2 of 7 1 2 34567
Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page

Apostolic Friends Forum (https://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/index.php)
-   Fellowship Hall (https://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=7)
-   -   The "Cracky" and "Wacky" Universalism (https://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/showthread.php?t=33580)

Socialite 02-04-2011 09:19 AM
Re: The "Cracky" and "Wacky" Universalism
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Praxeas (Post 1024846)
That "every knee will bow" does not equate "every heart will be saved". Also this is like me saying "Hey, are you coming to the party? Everyone will be there"..does not mean every one from every nation that ever lived and died or will be born and die will be there

Other verses speak on the purpose of what He did. Yet in context we often see a condition

Col 1:22 he has now reconciled in his body of flesh by his death, in order to present you holy and blameless and above reproach before him,
Col 1:23 if indeed you continue in the faith, stable and steadfast, not shifting from the hope of the gospel that you heard, which has been proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, became a minister.
Good stuff, Prax.

Even though this is part of a standard letter greeting/introduction, it has good theological points in it.

Quote:
And you, who once were alienated and hostile in mind,(BA) doing evil deeds, 22he has now reconciled(BB) in his body of flesh by his death,(BC) in order to present you holy and blameless and(BD) above reproach before him, 23(BE) if indeed you continue in the faith,(BF) stable and steadfast, not shifting from(BG) the hope of the gospel that you heard, which has been proclaimed(BH) in all creation[g] under heaven,(BI) and of which I, Paul, became a minister.

Ferd 02-04-2011 09:45 AM
Re: The "Cracky" and "Wacky" Universalism
 
where is Crackjack?

Cindy 02-04-2011 09:46 AM
Re: The "Cracky" and "Wacky" Universalism
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Socialite (Post 1024960)
Actually, TS, they are offered a way out through Jesus.

Read the post again -- God does not torture sinners forever, they are condemned and judged by their own actions, and God's own character, Justice. But He loved them enough to not only come up with a way out, but came Himself to be that Way out.
:thumbsup

Truthseeker 02-04-2011 10:13 AM
Re: The "Cracky" and "Wacky" Universalism
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Socialite (Post 1024960)
Actually, TS, they are offered a way out through Jesus.

Read the post again -- God does not torture sinners forever, they are condemned and judged by their own actions, and God's own character, Justice. But He loved them enough to not only come up with a way out, but came Himself to be that Way out.
If there is a burning hell then God does torture sinners.

If I got it right yopu believe hell is just a seperation from God? not an actual physical punishment?

crakjak 02-04-2011 10:36 AM
Re: The "Cracky" and "Wacky" Universalism
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Socialite (Post 1024833)
For God to Universally save everyone, there is no Gospel, no Mission, no Church, no Pentecost. If he "willed" it to be done, it would be done. No plan, no good news --- the reality is.... it's like saying can he create a rock too heavy to lift... he can't. He made us to have a choice. He's made it hard to refuse. He's made it difficult to turn down. He's drowned us in a sea of Grace when he shows up, but it can still be refused. It's the very nature and law of His own creation. It's that vulnerable flaw that gives it beauty --- life, instead of plastic reproduction.

But He's done all the work. He just asks us to rest, trust and believe in Him. Not a bad deal :)
The above view of God, is a god that is confused and impotent toward his creation, powerless to complete what he began. Why? because he failed to take in to account the power of Satan and the ALL POWERFUL WILL of those that he created.

This is not the God of the Bible, it is a god created in the image of his creation, by men who make excuses for the failure of the this wimpy creator.

BUT JESUS CHRIST THE TRUE GOD OF THE BIBLE, THE SAVIOR OF THE WORLD, TO THE RESCUE!!!!

"...FEAR NOT FOR I HAVE OVERCOME THE WORLD...!

Socialite 02-04-2011 10:52 AM
Re: The "Cracky" and "Wacky" Universalism
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by crakjak (Post 1025119)
The above view of God, is a god that is confused and impotent toward his creation, powerless to complete what he began. Why? because he failed to take in to account the power of Satan and the ALL POWERFUL WILL of those that he created.

This is not the God of the Bible, it is a god created in the image of his creation, by men who make excuses for the failure of the this wimpy creator.

BUT JESUS CHRIST THE TRUE GOD OF THE BIBLE, THE SAVIOR OF THE WORLD, TO THE RESCUE!!!!

"...FEAR NOT FOR I HAVE OVERCOME THE WORLD...!
A confused and powerless God? If he didn't respect our own will, there would have never been a fall to begin with. Let's keep it in perspective.

He didn't fail, He won. And he's offered a way out through Him... through Him... through Him... that is the Gospel!!

What are you reading, Crak?

Empty rhetoric, my friend, empty rhetoric.

Truthseeker 02-04-2011 11:07 AM
Re: The "Cracky" and "Wacky" Universalism
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Socialite (Post 1025170)
A confused and powerless God? If he didn't respect our own will, there would have never been a fall to begin with. Let's keep it in perspective.

He didn't fail, He won. And he's offered a way out through Him... through Him... through Him... that is the Gospel!!

What are you reading, Crak?

Empty rhetoric, my friend, empty rhetoric.
"own free will" That's another good topic. Does man have a freewill about being a sinner? Nope.

There are scriptures that seem to support both sides.

Didn't Jesus no man cometh to father lest he draws them?

crakjak 02-04-2011 11:15 AM
Re: The "Cracky" and "Wacky" Universalism
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Socialite (Post 1025170)
A confused and powerless God? If he didn't respect our own will, there would have never been a fall to begin with. Let's keep it in perspective. He didn't fail, He won. And he's offered a way out through Him... through Him... through Him... that is the Gospel!!

What are you reading, Crak?

Empty rhetoric, my friend, empty rhetoric.


Nonsense, my friend, He is the first cause, He set up the garden, and allowed the serpent access.

His original plan included the fall, for His full purpose. It is all plan A, no plan B.

If your view is correct, and you say he has "offered" a way out, why is it so unlikely for most humans to find this "way out"?

No, I believe we have been listening to "empty rhetoric" way too long. HE is not powerless or impotent to save, HE came and carried the load HIMSELF. And HE will save to the uttermost, HE is the refining fire that will "thoroughly" cleanse HIS creation.

Socialite 02-04-2011 11:41 AM
Re: The "Cracky" and "Wacky" Universalism
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by crakjak (Post 1025221)
Nonsense, my friend, He is the first cause, He set up the garden, and allowed the serpent access.

His original plan included the fall, for His full purpose. It is all plan A, no plan B.

If your view is correct, and you say he has "offered" a way out, why is it so unlikely for most humans to find this "way out"?

No, I believe we have been listening to "empty rhetoric" way too long. HE is not powerless or impotent to save, HE came and carried the load HIMSELF. And HE will save to the uttermost, HE is the refining fire that will "thoroughly" cleanse HIS creation.
What does the garden tell us about God? He wants to provide? What does the serpent's existence tell us about God? He wants us to not trust God's providence. God desires our trust. Us trusting Him that He knows what's best.

You have a lot of explaining to do if you believe The Fall was Plan A, God's will, that is pleases Him... Let's talk about a sadistic God, shall we.

Stop the strawman about him being "powerless" to save. His blood is life. Of course he came and carried the load Himself --- for all who believe. That fact is, I can't even list all the scriptures and quotes from the Gospels that include "for all who believe" "for all who are called" "for those whom he elected" "for those who love the Lord" etc... It would fill a list a couple pages long. Get your pen out!

Let's get back to the argument. Point-for-point, verse-for-verse, we could go on all day like this.

Ferd 02-04-2011 11:44 AM
Re: The "Cracky" and "Wacky" Universalism
 
Crackjack, you do not dissapoint!

I do not agree with you but that doesnt mean I dont respect your study and commitment to the cause!

Be blessed my friend!


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:14 AM.
Page 2 of 7 1 2 34567
Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.