Originally Posted by Costeon
(Post 1535533)
Could you clarify something please? In one of your posts you helpfully listed many translations of the 1 Cor 11.6. Many, mostly older, translations read "shorn." Most read "cut off." I may have overlooked some, but I only noticed two that read "cut her hair," which happen to be the ones I had seen on rdp's blog. In addition to those you have listed, I had also mentioned in a previous post the NAB and NJB and the NRSV and REB, in order to cover basically all the major versions that are popular among all the various strains of Christianity. As far as I can tell, then, two say "cut her hair."
When I read this post of yours, because so many that you had included read "cut off," and since "shorn" is generally used to mean "cut off (hair)," hence that generally being the first definition in English dictionaries, I thought you were pointing out to 1ofthechosen that the verb keiro that has been the focus of the debate, had only rarely (twice) been understood by translators as rdp and 1ofthechosen understand it (based on BDAG, etc.), i.e., simply to cut.
But when you then said in this current post "of course a woman shouldn't cut her hair" and say it would be a disgrace to her, clearly referring to v. 6, I was confused. Could you clarify why you say of course she shouldn't cut her hair, apparently basing this on v. 6, when you just had provided so much evidence from the translations that the verb in v. 6 probably doesn't mean just "to cut or trim"?
And regarding my emphasis on the translations, to all those reading these posts I want to say, I'm not trying to beat a dead horse, as others have characterized my posts, but since it seems overall that my position has been characterized by others as me standing alone in solitary splendor ignorantly rejecting the mountain of clear evidence from Greek experts, I'm just trying to show that hundreds of other Greek experts--the committees of scholars who produced these translations--do not accept that the verb means simply to cut at all or to trim. They are not ignorant of BDAG or other resources. All I can conclude is that they read these lexical works, noted that, say, BDAG only lists one verse (1 Cor 11.6) to support the definition "to cut", then studied how the verb is used in the rest of the Greek NT and the Greek OT (the Septuagint) and elsewhere in Koine Greek and concluded that the verb means more than "cut" but rather "cut off."
In short, the meaning of v. 6 is not so clear cut. :-) The verse is ambiguous, i.e., capable of different interpretations, and therefore we have to look at other passages in the Bible, using the principle that Scripture interprets Scripture, that is, the clear illuminates the unclear, to try to illuminate what is obscure in 1 Cor 11.6. I guess I have apparently overlooked the supporting verses that other posters have provided that show that keiro unambiguously means "to cut." I know a lot of examples have been provided from Greek lexical resources like BDAG that say "to cut," but what again are the other passages in the NT where this verb only means to cut or where woman are explicitly told not to cut their hair? I'm not trying to be difficult or obtuse. As far as I know, the OT does not contain such a command, and I've shown how this verb in the Greek OT means "cut off." So I would like to see the NT evidence for this meaning.
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